point is while serialization itself is not specified you have no more
guarantee with Serializable. ATM you can serialize your bean
passivationId and keep your bean instance in memory (in a map). You
didnt serialize anything excepted a string!

So why forcing such a constraint if it is an implementation detail?
Serialization process is not explicit so then constraint doesnt
guarantee any portability


Romain Manni-Bucau
@rmannibucau
http://www.tomitribe.com
http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
https://github.com/rmannibucau

2015-02-03 11:22 GMT+01:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil@gmail.com>:
> Guess Jozef pretty much hit the point, I don't care about the sticker or
> label you may put on your laptop or product, but a compatible behavior
> allowing users to deploy against as many available containers as possible
> with minimal or no changes at all;-)
>
> On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 11:17 AM, Jozef Hartinger <jharting@redhat.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> If we want applications to be portable across different implementations
>> then the spec should require the least common multiple - that is beans that
>> belong to passivating scopes being serializable. TomEE/OWB is free to have a
>> mode in which passivation requirements are not checked if the server runs in
>> non-passivating mode.
>>
>>
>> On 02/03/2015 11:03 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau wrote:
>>>
>>> servlet spec requirement is only for distributed systems AFAIK == not
>>> required in most of instances.
>>> tomee supports both and is aligned on tomcat for all tomee flavors and
>>> is serialization-less in openejb flavors
>>>
>>> That said this is not a certification question but a usage question
>>>
>>>
>>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>>> @rmannibucau
>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>>>
>>>
>>> 2015-02-03 10:59 GMT+01:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil@gmail.com>:
>>>>
>>>> What about TomEE?
>>>> After all it's Java EE 6 certified:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/javaee/overview/compatibility-jsp-136984.html
>>>>
>>>> So as Mark mentioned briefly, there is a requirement by the Servlet
>>>> spec, so
>>>> I assume it is either always on or at least on by default (otherwise a
>>>> TomEE
>>>> "tweaked" like that would no longer be Java EE compliant;-)
>>>>
>>>> Tomcat itself was never certified.
>>>>
>>>> Werner
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 9:39 AM, <cdi-dev-request@lists.jboss.org> wrote:
>>>>>
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>>>>> Today's Topics:
>>>>>
>>>>>     1. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Mark Struberg)
>>>>>     2. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>>>>>     3. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Mark Struberg)
>>>>>     4. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>>>>>     5. Re: Async events. We need ideas to improve CDI-499
>>>>>        (Jozef Hartinger)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Message: 4
>>>>> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 16:50:44 +0100
>>>>> From: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau@gmail.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [cdi-dev] Clarify scopes and serialization
>>>>> To: Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>
>>>>> Cc: cdi-dev <cdi-dev@lists.jboss.org>
>>>>> Message-ID:
>>>>>
>>>>> <CACLE=7MUGeq_bgdx0W_hPT-15-9ae_XdD3kab0P3vE4YHftKRg@mail.gmail.com>
>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> in a standard tomcat yes but not in most of embedded ones...and that's
>>>>> not the point anyway
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>>>>> @rmannibucau
>>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>>>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>>>>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2015-02-02 16:50 GMT+01:00 Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> but you HAVE to manually switch it off. By _default_ the serialization
>>>>>> is on...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> LieGrue,
>>>>>> strub
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Monday, 2 February 2015, 16:42, Romain Manni-Bucau
>>>>>>> <rmannibucau@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> @Mark: that's not true. 1) you can switch it off + I mainly spoke of
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> embedded case where it is true in 80% of cases
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>>>>>>> @rmannibucau
>>>>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>>>>>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>>>>>>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2015-02-02 16:38 GMT+01:00 Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>   Romain, that's not true. Tomcat by default ALWAYS serializes the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> session at shutdown! Even if you don't have a cluster set up. This is
>>>>>>> also
>>>>>>> required by the Servlets spec...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>   LieGrue,
>>>>>>>>   strub
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>