6:27 p.m.
Hi, all:
We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group with
regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us as
well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the "Obsidian
Generator", using Forge as a backend.
I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness for
running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include resource
consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have we yet
broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus far
using Forge Online?
I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements they've
devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the meantime,
mind describing where we currently stand?
S,
ALR
--
Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
@ALRubinger
7 p.m.
Hey Andrew,
Yes, this is a really important question, and it's something that I believe
that the Forge architecture supports out-of-the-box. Every interaction with
the UI API (the Forge commands, per say) is stored in a request-scoped
UIContext[1] object that is initialized when a command is invoked and
destroyed when the command finishes executing. That means that you can
execute multiple concurrent commands in a single Forge instance and they
will not affect each other.
When it comes to security, as a good practice, it is important to restrict
the commands that the exposed REST service can execute.
That's why in the Obsidian backend[2] we only expose a REST endpoint[3]
consuming the Forge API to execute a limited number of commands (more
specifically, the ones exposed by the obsidian-addon[4])
Last but not least, as the Forge Online app is just a PoC illustrating how
Forge can work in a web environment, it does not impose restrictions to the
supported commands, therefore it shouldn't be a web app to be used in
production.
PS: It would be nice to ping the Fabric8 team for this matter as they are
already using Forge as their project generator solution for a long time now.
I hope this helps. Looking forward to this list of requirements and happy
to discuss about this anytime.
[1] -
https://github.com/forge/core/tree/master/ui#uicommand-execution-lifecycle
[2] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend
[3] -
https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend/blob/master/src/mai...
[4] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/obsidian-addon
Best Regards,
*George Gastaldi*
https://onename.com/gastaldi
On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andrew Lee Rubinger <alr(a)redhat.com> wrote:
Hi, all:
We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group with
regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us as
well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the "Obsidian
Generator", using Forge as a backend.
I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness for
running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include resource
consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have we yet
broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus far
using Forge Online?
I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements they've
devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the meantime,
mind describing where we currently stand?
S,
ALR
--
Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
@ALRubinger
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing list
forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
7:17 p.m.
Thanks for the summary, George. I'll send interested parties to this
thread.
S,
ALR
On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 7:00 PM, George Gastaldi <ggastald(a)redhat.com>
wrote:
Hey Andrew,
Yes, this is a really important question, and it's something that I believe
that the Forge architecture supports out-of-the-box. Every interaction with
the UI API (the Forge commands, per say) is stored in a request-scoped
UIContext[1] object that is initialized when a command is invoked and
destroyed when the command finishes executing. That means that you can
execute multiple concurrent commands in a single Forge instance and they
will not affect each other.
When it comes to security, as a good practice, it is important to restrict
the commands that the exposed REST service can execute.
That's why in the Obsidian backend[2] we only expose a REST endpoint[3]
consuming the Forge API to execute a limited number of commands (more
specifically, the ones exposed by the obsidian-addon[4])
Last but not least, as the Forge Online app is just a PoC illustrating how
Forge can work in a web environment, it does not impose restrictions to the
supported commands, therefore it shouldn't be a web app to be used in
production.
PS: It would be nice to ping the Fabric8 team for this matter as they are
already using Forge as their project generator solution for a long time
now.
I hope this helps. Looking forward to this list of requirements and happy
to discuss about this anytime.
[1] -
https://github.com/forge/core/tree/master/ui#uicommand-execution-lifecycle
[2] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend
[3] -
https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend/
blob/master/src/main/java/org/obsidiantoaster/generator/
rest/ObsidianResource.java
[4] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/obsidian-addon
Best Regards,
*George Gastaldi*
https://onename.com/gastaldi
On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andrew Lee Rubinger <alr(a)redhat.com>
wrote:
> Hi, all:
>
> We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group with
> regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
>
> Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us as
> well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the "Obsidian
> Generator", using Forge as a backend.
>
> I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness for
> running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include
resource
> consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have we
yet
> broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus far
> using Forge Online?
>
> I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements they've
> devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the meantime,
> mind describing where we currently stand?
>
> S,
> ALR
>
> --
> Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
> @ALRubinger
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing list
forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
--
Twitter: @ALRubinger
7:31 a.m.
Hey Andrew,
Yes, this is a really important question, and it's something that I
believe
that the Forge architecture supports out-of-the-box. Every interaction
with
the UI API (the Forge commands, per say) is stored in a request-scoped
UIContext[1] object that is initialized when a command is invoked and
destroyed when the command finishes executing. That means that you can
execute multiple concurrent commands in a single Forge instance and
they
will not affect each other.
Excellent.
When it comes to security, as a good practice, it is important to
restrict
the commands that the exposed REST service can execute.
That's why in the Obsidian backend[2] we only expose a REST
endpoint[3]
consuming the Forge API to execute a limited number of commands (more
specifically, the ones exposed by the obsidian-addon[4])
Last but not least, as the Forge Online app is just a PoC illustrating
how
Forge can work in a web environment, it does not impose restrictions
to the
supported commands, therefore it shouldn't be a web app to be used in
production.
Since we need something for production I would be curious to know what
you feel are missing ?
PS: It would be nice to ping the Fabric8 team for this matter as they
are
already using Forge as their project generator solution for a long
time now.
In case you missed it - fabric8 team is now part of devtools and
devtools are fabric8 :)
We'll get James et.al. involved (they are in f2f meetings this week),
but as I understood
Fabric8 have a fork of the PoC adjusted to handle some more complex
workflows they were
exploring. Things they would like to get merged back as I understand it.
That said - to outline the items we were discussing about forge as a
SaaS:
Main reason we need it in first place is that Forge is *massive*, takes
up a lot of
resources - even more than Eclipse Che; thus we are very interested in
being able to run
Forge without having one instance per user.
In that we had some questions and concerns in addition to the ones
above:
A) can forge run without access to download updates etc. from maven and
similar ?
i.e. can we lock updates down and ensure it and its execution cannot
be altered
just because someone updated a plugin.
(We discussed firewalling it completely to be sure :)
B) Is there a way to ensure that secrets like GitHub auth keys and
others are
not exposed to users nor in logs ?
C) Any expectations/ideas on how we would integrate obsidian generators
with
fabric8 ?
Two options we considered:
1) call out to separate hosted obsidian-toaster and run the risk of
exposing secrets on wire.
2) run obsidian-toaster or a copy of it inside fabric8 online so
we don't expose any secrets.
Pete and others might have more, but above are the ones I wrote down
while being on bluejeans to the conversations.
I hope this helps. Looking forward to this list of requirements and
happy
to discuss about this anytime.
[1] -
https://github.com/forge/core/tree/master/ui#uicommand-execution-lifecycle
[2] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend
[3] -
https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend/blob/master/src/mai...
[4] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/obsidian-addon
Best Regards,
*George Gastaldi*
https://onename.com/gastaldi
On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andrew Lee Rubinger <alr(a)redhat.com>
wrote:
> Hi, all:
>
> We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group
> with
> regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
>
> Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us
> as
> well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the
> "Obsidian
> Generator", using Forge as a backend.
>
> I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness
> for
> running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include
> resource
> consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have
> we yet
> broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus
> far
> using Forge Online?
>
> I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements they've
> devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the
> meantime,
> mind describing where we currently stand?
>
> S,
> ALR
>
> --
> Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
> @ALRubinger
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing list
forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
/max
http://about.me/maxandersen
7:56 a.m.
Hi Max,
Thanks for your questions, I provided my answers inline.
Best Regards,
*George Gastaldi*
https://onename.com/gastaldi
On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 10:31 AM, Max Rydahl Andersen <manderse(a)redhat.com>
wrote:
> Hey Andrew,
>
> Yes, this is a really important question, and it's something that I
> believe
> that the Forge architecture supports out-of-the-box. Every interaction
> with
> the UI API (the Forge commands, per say) is stored in a request-scoped
> UIContext[1] object that is initialized when a command is invoked and
> destroyed when the command finishes executing. That means that you can
> execute multiple concurrent commands in a single Forge instance and
> they
> will not affect each other.
Excellent.
> When it comes to security, as a good practice, it is important to
> restrict
> the commands that the exposed REST service can execute.
> That's why in the Obsidian backend[2] we only expose a REST
> endpoint[3]
> consuming the Forge API to execute a limited number of commands (more
> specifically, the ones exposed by the obsidian-addon[4])
>
> Last but not least, as the Forge Online app is just a PoC illustrating
> how
> Forge can work in a web environment, it does not impose restrictions
> to the
> supported commands, therefore it shouldn't be a web app to be used in
> production.
Since we need something for production I would be curious to know what
you feel are missing ?
I was referring to the UI offered by Forge Online app (
https://github.com/forge/forge-service/tree/master/web). The core libraries
is already being used in the Obsidian Toaster and Fabric8 (not the same
binaries/packages, but the code is similar)
> PS: It would be nice to ping the Fabric8 team for this matter as they
> are
> already using Forge as their project generator solution for a long
> time now.
In case you missed it - fabric8 team is now part of devtools and
devtools are fabric8 :)
We'll get James et.al. involved (they are in f2f meetings this week),
but as I understood
Fabric8 have a fork of the PoC adjusted to handle some more complex
workflows they were
exploring. Things they would like to get merged back as I understand it.
Good, yes, that's right
That said - to outline the items we were discussing about forge as a
SaaS:
Main reason we need it in first place is that Forge is *massive*, takes
up a lot of
resources - even more than Eclipse Che; thus we are very interested in
being able to run
Forge without having one instance per user.
I need some numbers here regarding the "a lot of resources - even more
than
Eclipse Che". Is that because it creates a Weld instance per addon
that depends on the furnace-cdi container?
Most of the core addons depend on the furnace-simple container, which does
not boot Weld.
Also, Weld is no longer heavy, you know :)
In that we had some questions and concerns in addition to the ones
above:
A) can forge run without access to download updates etc. from maven and
similar ?
i.e. can we lock updates down and ensure it and its execution cannot
be altered
just because someone updated a plugin.
(We discussed firewalling it completely to be sure :)
No updates are downloaded automatically in Forge. There are commands to
install and
update addons, but if you don't expose those commands that will
never happen.
Forge loads the addons on a specified directory. If nothing is deployed
there (by any external process), it won't change anything
In addition, you can specify a settings.xml with <offline> set to ensure
that the Maven API won't try to look for any remote data.
B) Is there a way to ensure that secrets like GitHub auth keys and
others are
not exposed to users nor in logs ?
Yes, you can use the Configuration addon for that. There is an example
encrypting data here:
https://github.com/forge/core/blob/master/database-tools/impl/src/main/ja...
(maybe that's not a good example, but you get the idea)
Basically with this addon you'll have this information read from a
properties file (the contents may be encrypted or not - that's up to you).
If that's not enough, we can create a Forge addon or improve any of the
core ones that does what you need.
C) Any expectations/ideas on how we would integrate obsidian
generators
with
fabric8 ?
Two options we considered:
1) call out to separate hosted obsidian-toaster and run the
risk of
exposing secrets on wire.
2) run obsidian-toaster or a copy of it inside fabric8 online so
we don't expose any secrets.
The obsidian-toaster backend consists of a Forge addon + a JAX-RS resource.
You could deploy this addon in the Fabric8 Forge service and invoke the UI
that Fabric8 renders dynamically based on the command's metadata (it
consumes the same JSON afaik)
Or you could do #2.
Pete and others might have more, but above are the ones I wrote down
while being on bluejeans to the conversations.
> I hope this helps. Looking forward to this list of requirements and
> happy
> to discuss about this anytime.
>
> [1] -
> https://github.com/forge/core/tree/master/ui#uicommand-
execution-lifecycle
> [2] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend
> [3] -
> https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend/
blob/master/src/main/java/org/obsidiantoaster/generator/
rest/ObsidianResource.java
> [4] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/obsidian-addon
>
> Best Regards,
>
> *George Gastaldi*
>
> https://onename.com/gastaldi
>
> On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andrew Lee Rubinger <alr(a)redhat.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi, all:
>>
>> We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group
>> with
>> regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
>>
>> Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us
>> as
>> well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the
>> "Obsidian
>> Generator", using Forge as a backend.
>>
>> I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness
>> for
>> running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include
>> resource
>> consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have
>> we yet
>> broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus
>> far
>> using Forge Online?
>>
>> I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements they've
>> devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the
>> meantime,
>> mind describing where we currently stand?
>>
>> S,
>> ALR
>>
>> --
>> Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
>> @ALRubinger
>> _______________________________________________
>> forge-dev mailing list
>> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>>
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
/max
http://about.me/maxandersen
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing list
forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
9:03 a.m.
On Wednesday, 1 February 2017, Max Rydahl Andersen <manderse(a)redhat.com>
wrote:
> Hey Andrew,
>
> Yes, this is a really important question, and it's something that I
> believe
> that the Forge architecture supports out-of-the-box. Every interaction
> with
> the UI API (the Forge commands, per say) is stored in a request-scoped
> UIContext[1] object that is initialized when a command is invoked and
> destroyed when the command finishes executing. That means that you can
> execute multiple concurrent commands in a single Forge instance and
> they
> will not affect each other.
Excellent.
My understanding of the flow then is something like this:
1) The user works through one or more screens, inputting fields that
describe what they want
2) The web UI creates Forge commands from this, batching them all up to
send in a single request to the server
3) On receiving commands the server executes them in Forge, generates a
response, and then cleans up any resources generated on the server side
In other words, Forge as a Service is not stateful in anyway, so each time
you send a request, Forge must rebuild the project context.
If so, this sounds good, as IIRC Forge can build project contexts
relatively quickly.
A couple of things to follow up on in this area:
1) How confident are you with the cleanup step - principally I'm wondering
if you ensure a cleanup by using some sort of temporary file system whilst
the request is in progress and then removing it once the request completes?
Note that our backup thought here was just to cycle the container running
Forge regularly so that we don't run risk running out of disk space, so
this is not overly critical.
2) Actually this is related - how are you isolating projects on the server
side, particularly with disk?
> When it comes to security, as a good practice, it is important to
> restrict
> the commands that the exposed REST service can execute.
> That's why in the Obsidian backend[2] we only expose a REST
> endpoint[3]
> consuming the Forge API to execute a limited number of commands (more
> specifically, the ones exposed by the obsidian-addon[4])
Very sensible :-)
>
> Last but not least, as the Forge Online app is just a PoC illustrating
> how
> Forge can work in a web environment, it does not impose restrictions
> to the
> supported commands, therefore it shouldn't be a web app to be used in
> production.
We wouldn't want to use this app directly anyway...
Since we need something for production I would be curious to know what
you feel are missing ?
> PS: It would be nice to ping the Fabric8 team for this matter as they
> are
> already using Forge as their project generator solution for a long
> time now.
In case you missed it - fabric8 team is now part of devtools and
devtools are fabric8 :)
We'll get James et.al. involved (they are in f2f meetings this week),
but as I understood
Fabric8 have a fork of the PoC adjusted to handle some more complex
workflows they were
exploring. Things they would like to get merged back as I understand it.
That said - to outline the items we were discussing about forge as a
SaaS:
Main reason we need it in first place is that Forge is *massive*, takes
up a lot of
resources - even more than Eclipse Che; thus we are very interested in
being able to run
Forge without having one instance per user.
In that we had some questions and concerns in addition to the ones
above:
A) can forge run without access to download updates etc. from maven and
similar ?
i.e. can we lock updates down and ensure it and its execution cannot
be altered
just because someone updated a plugin.
(We discussed firewalling it completely to be sure :)
B) Is there a way to ensure that secrets like GitHub auth keys and
others are
not exposed to users nor in logs ?
C) Any expectations/ideas on how we would integrate obsidian generators
with
fabric8 ?
Two options we considered:
1) call out to separate hosted obsidian-toaster and run the
risk of
exposing secrets on wire.
2) run obsidian-toaster or a copy of it inside fabric8 online so
we don't expose any secrets.
Pete and others might have more, but above are the ones I wrote down
while being on bluejeans to the conversations.
> I hope this helps. Looking forward to this list of requirements and
> happy
> to discuss about this anytime.
>
> [1] -
> https://github.com/forge/core/tree/master/ui#uicommand-
execution-lifecycle
> [2] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend
> [3] -
> https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend/
blob/master/src/main/java/org/obsidiantoaster/generator/
rest/ObsidianResource.java
> [4] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/obsidian-addon
>
> Best Regards,
>
> *George Gastaldi*
>
> https://onename.com/gastaldi
>
> On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andrew Lee Rubinger <alr(a)redhat.com
<javascript:;>>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi, all:
>>
>> We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group
>> with
>> regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
>>
>> Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us
>> as
>> well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the
>> "Obsidian
>> Generator", using Forge as a backend.
>>
>> I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness
>> for
>> running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include
>> resource
>> consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have
>> we yet
>> broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus
>> far
>> using Forge Online?
>>
>> I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements they've
>> devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the
>> meantime,
>> mind describing where we currently stand?
>>
>> S,
>> ALR
>>
>> --
>> Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
>> @ALRubinger
>> _______________________________________________
>> forge-dev mailing list
>> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <javascript:;>
>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>>
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <javascript:;>
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
/max
http://about.me/maxandersen
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing list
forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <javascript:;>
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
9:03 a.m.
On Wednesday, 1 February 2017, George Gastaldi <ggastald(a)redhat.com> wrote:
Hi Max,
Thanks for your questions, I provided my answers inline.
Best Regards,
*George Gastaldi*
https://onename.com/gastaldi
On Wed, Feb 1, 2017 at 10:31 AM, Max Rydahl Andersen <manderse(a)redhat.com
<javascript:;>>
wrote:
>
> > Hey Andrew,
> >
> > Yes, this is a really important question, and it's something that I
> > believe
> > that the Forge architecture supports out-of-the-box. Every interaction
> > with
> > the UI API (the Forge commands, per say) is stored in a request-scoped
> > UIContext[1] object that is initialized when a command is invoked and
> > destroyed when the command finishes executing. That means that you can
> > execute multiple concurrent commands in a single Forge instance and
> > they
> > will not affect each other.
>
> Excellent.
>
> > When it comes to security, as a good practice, it is important to
> > restrict
> > the commands that the exposed REST service can execute.
> > That's why in the Obsidian backend[2] we only expose a REST
> > endpoint[3]
> > consuming the Forge API to execute a limited number of commands (more
> > specifically, the ones exposed by the obsidian-addon[4])
> >
> > Last but not least, as the Forge Online app is just a PoC illustrating
> > how
> > Forge can work in a web environment, it does not impose restrictions
> > to the
> > supported commands, therefore it shouldn't be a web app to be used in
> > production.
>
> Since we need something for production I would be curious to know what
> you feel are missing ?
>
I was referring to the UI offered by Forge Online app (
https://github.com/forge/forge-service/tree/master/web). The core
libraries
is already being used in the Obsidian Toaster and Fabric8 (not the same
binaries/packages, but the code is similar)
>
> > PS: It would be nice to ping the Fabric8 team for this matter as they
> > are
> > already using Forge as their project generator solution for a long
> > time now.
>
> In case you missed it - fabric8 team is now part of devtools and
> devtools are fabric8 :)
>
> We'll get James et.al. involved (they are in f2f meetings this week),
> but as I understood
> Fabric8 have a fork of the PoC adjusted to handle some more complex
> workflows they were
> exploring. Things they would like to get merged back as I understand it.
>
> Good, yes, that's right
> That said - to outline the items we were discussing about forge as a
> SaaS:
>
> Main reason we need it in first place is that Forge is *massive*, takes
> up a lot of
> resources - even more than Eclipse Che; thus we are very interested in
> being able to run
> Forge without having one instance per user.
>
> I need some numbers here regarding the "a lot of resources - even more
than Eclipse Che". Is that because it creates a Weld instance per addon
that depends on the furnace-cdi container?
Most of the core addons depend on the furnace-simple container, which does
not boot Weld.
Also, Weld is no longer heavy, you know :)
It's better to think about this in terms of complexity. If we have to run 1
Forge per user, then even the memory overhead of the JVM is something we
want to avoid, as then for every user we have, our resource costs increase.
If we can share Forge among many users, we have a much better scale factor.
> In that we had some questions and concerns in addition to the ones
> above:
>
> A) can forge run without access to download updates etc. from maven and
> similar ?
> i.e. can we lock updates down and ensure it and its execution cannot
> be altered
> just because someone updated a plugin.
> (We discussed firewalling it completely to be sure :)
>
> No updates are downloaded automatically in Forge. There are commands to
install and update addons, but if you don't expose those commands that will
never happen.
Forge loads the addons on a specified directory. If nothing is deployed
there (by any external process), it won't change anything
In addition, you can specify a settings.xml with <offline> set to ensure
that the Maven API won't try to look for any remote data.
Great points.
B) Is there a way to ensure that secrets like GitHub auth keys and
> others are
> not exposed to users nor in logs ?
>
Yes, you can use the Configuration addon for that. There is an example
encrypting data here:
https://github.com/forge/core/blob/master/database-tools/
impl/src/main/java/org/jboss/forge/addon/database/tools/connections/
ConnectionProfileManagerImpl.java#L82
(maybe that's not a good example, but you get the idea)
Basically with this addon you'll have this information read from a
properties file (the contents may be encrypted or not - that's up to you).
If that's not enough, we can create a Forge addon or improve any of the
core ones that does what you need.
We would need a way to pass the github token in the request that the user
sends, as we will be holding one per user.
> C) Any expectations/ideas on how we would integrate obsidian generators
> with
> fabric8 ?
> Two options we considered:
> 1) call out to separate hosted obsidian-toaster and run the
> risk of
> exposing secrets on wire.
> 2) run obsidian-toaster or a copy of it inside fabric8 online so
> we don't expose any secrets.
>
The obsidian-toaster backend consists of a Forge addon + a JAX-RS resource.
You could deploy this addon in the Fabric8 Forge service and invoke the UI
that Fabric8 renders dynamically based on the command's metadata (it
consumes the same JSON afaik)
I would strongly prefer (1) as it allows us to treat
Forge-really-as-a-service ;-)
Or you could do #2.
>
> Pete and others might have more, but above are the ones I wrote down
> while being on bluejeans to the conversations.
>
> > I hope this helps. Looking forward to this list of requirements and
> > happy
> > to discuss about this anytime.
> >
> > [1] -
> > https://github.com/forge/core/tree/master/ui#uicommand-
> execution-lifecycle
> > [2] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend
> > [3] -
> > https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/generator-backend/
> blob/master/src/main/java/org/obsidiantoaster/generator/
> rest/ObsidianResource.java
> > [4] - https://github.com/obsidian-toaster/obsidian-addon
> >
> > Best Regards,
> >
> > *George Gastaldi*
> >
> > https://onename.com/gastaldi
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 9:27 PM, Andrew Lee Rubinger <alr(a)redhat.com
<javascript:;>>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Hi, all:
> >>
> >> We have some requests coming down the pike from the Developer Group
> >> with
> >> regards to running Forge as a Service (which is great!).
> >>
> >> Additionally, I'm suspecting this will soon be very important for us
> >> as
> >> well, as we continue to build out what's currently known as the
> >> "Obsidian
> >> Generator", using Forge as a backend.
> >>
> >> I'm hoping the Forge team will kindly advise as to our preparedness
> >> for
> >> running Forge in a multitenant environment. Concerns may include
> >> resource
> >> consumption (not running an instance-per-user), security, etc. Have
> >> we yet
> >> broached this subject specifically in the prototypes I've seen thus
> >> far
> >> using Forge Online?
> >>
> >> I've requested of the Developer Group a list of requirements
they've
> >> devised; will send those along here when I have them. In the
> >> meantime,
> >> mind describing where we currently stand?
> >>
> >> S,
> >> ALR
> >>
> >> --
> >> Red Hat Developer Group Architecture
> >> @ALRubinger
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> forge-dev mailing list
> >> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <javascript:;>
> >> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > forge-dev mailing list
> > forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <javascript:;>
> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
>
> /max
> http://about.me/maxandersen
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <javascript:;>
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
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participants (4)
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Andrew Lee Rubinger -
George Gastaldi -
Max Rydahl Andersen -
Pete Muir