[cdi-dev] Time to start working on CDI lite

Sun Aug 30 14:29:18 EDT 2015

As there is well-established event handling on the SE and ME side, in most
cases based on java.util.EventObject, I could imagine CDI events being
either outside a "lite" profile or at least optional, should we consider
optionality.

Werner

On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 6:10 PM, <cdi-dev-request at lists.jboss.org> wrote:

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>    1. Re: cdi-dev Digest, Vol 57, Issue 33 (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>    2. Re: Time to start working on CDI lite (Antonio Goncalves)
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> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 18:09:41 +0200
> From: Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [cdi-dev] Time to start working on CDI lite
> To: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau at gmail.com>
> Cc: cdi-dev <cdi-dev at lists.jboss.org>
> Message-ID:
>         <CA+ZZq9-YFcTKuZr=+6v=
> wH-w670E++qgBrN36DsToFEidUzenQ at mail.gmail.com>
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>
> For me, a Light version of CDI is clearly the features number. That's why I
> don't see events in it.
>
> For me, a CDI Lite would just focus on DI. If CDI has @Produces and Spring
> has @Bean, then it's because 330 lakes this functionality.
>
> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 4:02 PM, Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau at gmail.com
> >
> wrote:
>
> > Lite can have several definition, let's try to list them up if it can
> help:
> >
> > - binary size: for me until 3M for an app it is "Lite"
> > - features number: the whole IoC set of feature is light since you almost
> > always need it, it means you can do lighter but it wouldnt be used -
> check
> > spring, who uses only spring-ioc and not context or more?
> > - features complexity: sure we are not light here but supporting scopes
> > already breaks "Lite-ness" IMO so not a real issue
> >
> > So my view is CDI "SE" is light enough - as a spec and spec can't affect
> > implementations so seems the fight is not on the right side to me.
> >
> >
> >
> > Romain Manni-Bucau
> > @rmannibucau <https://twitter.com/rmannibucau> |  Blog
> > <http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com> | Github
> > <https://github.com/rmannibucau> | LinkedIn
> > <https://www.linkedin.com/in/rmannibucau> | Tomitriber
> > <http://www.tomitribe.com>
> >
> > 2015-08-30 15:57 GMT+02:00 Antonio Goncalves <
> antonio.goncalves at gmail.com>
> > :
> >
> >> It's funny, I feel I'm in Rod Johnson shoes back in Java EE 6 where he
> >> forked 330 because he found CDI was doing too much  ;o)
> >>
> >> For me, "CDI Lite" was just basic dependency injection. The fact that
> CDI
> >> can now run on SE (like JPA....), is good... but for me it has nothing
> to
> >> do with Light : it's the entire thing that can bootstrap in SE. Good.
> >>
> >> So what is Lite for you guys ?
> >>
> >> Antonio
> >>
> >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 3:44 PM, Romain Manni-Bucau <
> >> rmannibucau at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> 2015-08-30 15:22 GMT+02:00 John D. Ament <john.d.ament at gmail.com>:
> >>>
> >>>> Personally, I'm not in favor of a slimmed down runtime.  It was tried
> >>>> with EJB, but never implemented properly (most implementations that
> support
> >>>> EJB-lite actually support the entire thing, except for deprecated
> stuff).
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>> +1, most of CDI is basic and quickly any light version will miss events
> >>> or other thing - in particular in maintaining micro services from
> >>> experience. Size of an implementation can easily be < 1M so not sure it
> >>> would bring anything. Only important point is what Antoine started to
> do ie
> >>> ensuring EE and SE parts are clearly identified and split in the spec.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> I think if we define SE properly we won't have a need for this.
> >>>>
> >>>> John
> >>>>
> >>>> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 8:07 AM Antonio Goncalves <
> >>>> antonio.goncalves at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> @Antoine, so which content do you see in CDI Lite ? Are you sure
> about
> >>>>> events ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I'm in favor of a "fatter" 330 that would have :
> >>>>>
> >>>>>    - @Inject : already there
> >>>>>    - @Qualifier : already there
> >>>>>    -
> >>>>> *Producers and disposers *
> >>>>>    -
> >>>>> *Programatic lookup *
> >>>>>    - *Java SE Bootstrap*
> >>>>>
> >>>>> When you say "*The goal here is not to propose a new EE profile but a
> >>>>> subspec*", 330 could already be seen as a subspec. If you put events
> >>>>> apparts, what would be missing in this list in your point of view ?
> And
> >>>>> what obstacles do you see in archieving this ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> To boostrap CDI we have a CDIProvider, why not having an
> >>>>> InjectionProvider just to bootstrap 330 (then, CDIProvider could
> extend
> >>>>> InjectionProvider, so it bootstraps the all thing) ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Antonio
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Antoine Sabot-Durand <
> >>>>> antoine at sabot-durand.net> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Yes Arjan, I think it's the first reason. We really should work with
> >>>>>> them to understand what should be added to CDI 2.0 to have it as a
> first
> >>>>>> citizen DI in their spec.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Le sam. 29 ao?t 2015 ? 23:15, arjan tijms <arjan.tijms at gmail.com> a
> >>>>>> ?crit :
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 8:45 PM, Antonio Goncalves
> >>>>>>> <antonio.goncalves at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>> > I remember talking with the JAX-RS guys (Java EE), years ago
> (back
> >>>>>>> in EE6),
> >>>>>>> > and their answer for not adopting CDI was "too heavy".
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I can't find an exact reference anymore, but I somewhat remember
> that
> >>>>>>> one of the reasons was also simply that CDI as a general solution
> >>>>>>> finished late in Java EE 6, while JAX-RS finished earlier and had
> all
> >>>>>>> the work for their own DI solution already done.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Antonio Goncalves
> >>>>> Software architect, Java Champion and Pluralsight author
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Web site <http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter
> >>>>> <http://twitter.com/agoncal> | LinkedIn
> >>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> | Pluralsight
> >>>>> <http://pluralsight.com/training/Authors/Details/antonio-goncalves>
> | Paris
> >>>>> JUG <http://www.parisjug.org> | Devoxx France <http://www.devoxx.fr>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Antonio Goncalves
> >> Software architect, Java Champion and Pluralsight author
> >>
> >> Web site <http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter
> >> <http://twitter.com/agoncal> | LinkedIn
> >> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> | Pluralsight
> >> <http://pluralsight.com/training/Authors/Details/antonio-goncalves> |
> Paris
> >> JUG <http://www.parisjug.org> | Devoxx France <http://www.devoxx.fr>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Antonio Goncalves
> Software architect, Java Champion and Pluralsight author
>
> Web site <http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter
> <http://twitter.com/agoncal> | LinkedIn <
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> |
> Pluralsight
> <http://pluralsight.com/training/Authors/Details/antonio-goncalves> |
> Paris
> JUG <http://www.parisjug.org> | Devoxx France <http://www.devoxx.fr>
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