[hibernate-dev] Chat migration - D minus 115 until the death of HipChat

Gunnar Morling gunnar at hibernate.org
Mon Nov 12 05:21:00 EST 2018 

Have you tried "Room Settings" -> "Notifications"? We're on Gitter for
Debezium, too, and in fact the notifications were too noisy for me, so
I turned them off :)

--Gunnar

Am Mo., 12. Nov. 2018 um 10:59 Uhr schrieb Guillaume Smet
<guillaume.smet at gmail.com>:
>
> Hi,
>
> So, one thing I find particularly annoying with Gitter now that we are
> trying to use it for real interactions is the lack of notification sounds
> in the webapp. When you're focused on your work, it's really easy to miss
> the visual ones and having a sound really helped on HipChat.
>
> There is an open issue here:
> https://gitlab.com/gitlab-org/gitter/webapp/issues/735 .
>
> AFAICS in the commit log, there's one person working on Gitter and it's not
> making tremendous progress.
>
> (Yeah, I know, it's Open Source, I can contribute...)
>
> --
> Guillaume
>
> On Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 3:47 PM Yoann Rodiere <yoann at hibernate.org> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> > TL;DR: I created the Gitter rooms. Let's all go there for a few days, at
> > least to try it?
> >
> > *Connecting*
> >
> > Obviously you can just connect to https://gitter.im/ and use the browser.
> > You can sign in with your Github, Gitlab or Twitter account.
> >
> > There are also desktop/mobile applications. https://gitter.im/apps
> > They only provide .deb packages, though, and I wasn't able to convert them
> > easily using alien (I didn't try very hard). There is a snap out there, but
> > it's an old version that isn't allow to use the Gitter APIs anymore.
> >
> > If you prefer to use IRC, they apparently provide a bridge. I don't know
> > what it's worth, but you can always give it a try: see
> > https://irc.gitter.im/ .
> >
> > *What's next?*
> >
> > Let's try to use it for a few days, see if everyone is comfortable with it?
> > Let's see if there isn't any blocker for anyone, and if the news from other
> > projects (such as WildFly moving to Slack) don't make use change our minds.
> >
> > Then if everyone is okay with it, we can finalize everything:
> >
> >    - Invite external people to our rooms (I didn't invite anyone except our
> >    own team)
> >    - Advertise Gitter as our main chat platform:
> >    - On our websites
> >       - On IRC (we should at least mention it in the "message of the day")
> >       - On the hibernate-announce mailing list
> >       - In the REAME file of our projects through a badge: [![Gitter](
> >       https://badges.gitter.im/hibernate/hibernate-room-id.svg)](
> >       https://gitter.im/hibernate/hibernate-room-id
> >       ?utm_source=badge&utm_medium=badge&utm_campaign=pr-badge)
> >    - Close the HipChat rooms somehow.
> >
> > *Available rooms*
> >
> > For each of our main projects, I created one room bound to the GitHub
> > repository for users, and *one *-dev room for our own use*.
> > I also created rooms based on what I could see in HipChat (branding, ...).
> >
> > You can find a list of all rooms here: https://gitter.im/hibernate/home
> >
> > I already added people according to which room they were member of in
> > HipChat, but I may have missed some. Please check which room you are
> > subscribed to.
> >
> > *Settings*
> >
> > You can configure how often you want to be notified for each room: go to
> > the room, click on the "settings" button next to your avatar on the top
> > right, then "Notifications".
> > In this same popup, you have the option of setting general defaults.
> >
> > Also, a dark theme is available: click on your avatar on the top right,
> > then "Toggle Dark Theme".
> >
> > That's pretty much it.
> >
> > *Configuring your rooms*
> >
> > I configured the main rooms to  receive Github notifications on the
> > "activity tab" to the right, as well as Jenkins notifications for the
> > "master" and "PR" job (when I found it). Feel free to add more integration
> > if you want to.
> >
> > How to add a Jenkins integration:
> >
> >    - If your room doesn't have a Jenkins integration yet (most have):
> >    - Go to the room on Gitter
> >       - Click on the "settings" button next to your avatar on the top
> >       right, then "Integrations".
> >       - Select "Jenkins"
> >       - Select the events you want to be notified of
> >       - Copy the webhook URL near the bottom
> >       - Create new credentials on Jenkins:
> >
> > http://ci.hibernate.org/credentials/store/system/domain/_/newCredentials
> >          - In the "Kind" field, select "Secret text"
> >          - Leave the "Scope" to "Global"
> >          - In the "Secret" field, paste the webhook URL
> >          - In the "ID" field, put "gitter-webhook-url-<ID of your room>"
> >          - In the "description" field, put "Gitter webhook URL for the <ID
> >          of your room> room"
> >          - Click "OK"
> >          - For each Jenkins job:
> >       - On the job page in Jenkins, click "Configure"
> >       - Select the "Job Notifications" tab near the top
> >       - Click "Add endpoint"
> >       - Leave the format to "JSON" and the protocol to "HTTP"
> >       - Set "URL Source" to "Credentials Store"
> >       - In the "URL" box, select the entry corresponding to your room,
> >       which should normally appear as "Gitter webhook URL for the <ID of
> >       your room> room"
> >       - Click "Save"
> >
> >
> >
> > Hibernate NoORM Team
> > yoann at hibernate.org
> >
> >
> > On Tue, 6 Nov 2018 at 11:40, Yoann Rodiere <yoann at hibernate.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I think all day-to-day users of our chat voted. Here are the results:
> > >
> > > IRC:     4 Yes, 5 "if need be", 6 no.
> > > Slack:   5 Yes, 3 "if need be", 7 no
> > > Zulip:   5 Yes, 3 "if need be", 7 no
> > > Gitter: 10 Yes, 1 "if need be", 4 no
> > >
> > > It seems Gitter won. That's the only option with more "Yes" than "No"...
> > > It's got the most "Yes" (even counting "if need be"), and perhaps more
> > > importantly it's got the least amount of "no".
> > >
> > > To those who voted no: if you have specific concerns about Gitter, could
> > > you please mention them here? Maybe we can find solutions to some of the
> > > problems.
> > >
> > > I'll look into moving the Hibernate Search chat to Gitter and will report
> > > back on this thread.
> > >
> > > Yoann Rodière
> > > Hibernate NoORM Team
> > > yoann at hibernate.org
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, 5 Nov 2018 at 08:25, Yoann Rodiere <yoann at hibernate.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Not everyone voted, far from it; we're missing votes from Gail,
> > >> Guillaume, Fabio, Chris, Davide, Emmanuel, Koen. So no, no consensus
> > yet.
> > >>
> > >> I sent an email to them off-list, perhaps they didn't see this thread.
> > >>
> > >> Provisional results are as follows:
> > >>
> > >> IRC: 2 Yes, 3 "if need be", 3 no
> > >> Slack: 2 Yes, 2 "if need be", 4 no
> > >> Zulip: 2 Yes, 3 "if need be", 3 no
> > >> Gitter: 6 Yes, 0 "if need be", 2 no
> > >>
> > >> So Gitter seems on the verge of winning, but apparently some people are
> > >> categorically against it, so I'd say we'll have to give them a chance to
> > >> explain why. I'll wait for everyone to answer, though, since they could
> > >> completely change the results.
> > >>
> > >> Yoann Rodière
> > >> Hibernate NoORM Team
> > >> yoann at hibernate.org
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Sat, 3 Nov 2018 at 13:35, Steve Ebersole <steve at hibernate.org>
> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Any consensus on this yet?
> > >>>
> > >>> On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 5:21 AM Sanne Grinovero <sanne at hibernate.org>
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> Thanks for starting this!
> > >>>>
> > >>>> The choice of IRC is a bit special on the list as we never intended it
> > >>>> to be killed: it has been historically important and we should
> > >>>> maintain some level of reachability on it.  So voting for the "IRC"
> > >>>> choice just means a preference to not use anything else on top of it,
> > >>>> while alternatively we'' be using X on top of IRC, albeit with a
> > >>>> preference to use X for team conversations.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Also good to remind: please try to be on IRC as well occasionally as
> > >>>> many in the OSS community we integrate with will reach out there.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Thanks,
> > >>>> Sanne
> > >>>>
> > >>>> On Tue, 23 Oct 2018 at 09:46, Yoann Rodiere <yoann at hibernate.org>
> > >>>> wrote:
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > Hi,
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > TL;DR: please vote here if you don't want to end up having to use a
> > >>>> chat
> > >>>> > tool you don't like: https://doodle.com/poll/h6scc9bsh6a4ymre
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > HipChat Cloud will stop working on February 15th, 2019 [1]. We need
> > to
> > >>>> > choose an alternative before we have our back against the wall, so
> > >>>> I'll try
> > >>>> > to resurrect the conversation.
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > As a reminder, Stride is no longer an option: Atlassian cancelled
> > the
> > >>>> > project, and encourages users to migrate to Slack.
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > The discussed options so far were:
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> >    - *Moving back to IRC*. Aye: ?; nay: ?
> > >>>> >    Pros: simple as hell.
> > >>>> >    Cons: basic as hell; we won't keep the chat history.
> > >>>> >    - *Migrating to Slack* [6], as suggested by Atlassian [2]. Aye:
> > >>>> >    Christian B; Nay: ?
> > >>>> >    Pros: we will keep the chat history (I think).
> > >>>> >    Cons: not open-source; desktop client consumes a lot of
> > resources.
> > >>>> >    - *Migrating to Zulip* [3]. Aye: Emmanuel, Yoann. Nay: Guillaume
> > >>>> (kind
> > >>>> >    of).
> > >>>> >    Pros: Advanced conversation management thanks to the "topics"
> > >>>> feature.
> > >>>> >    Cons: Complex to use because of the "topics" feature; we won't
> > >>>> keep the
> > >>>> >    chat history (1).
> > >>>> >    - *Migrating to Gitter* [5] (we'll create different rooms,
> > >>>> probably).
> > >>>> >    Aye: ?, Nay: ?
> > >>>> >    Pros: Users seem to actually go there, so we could have our "live
> > >>>> >    support" rooms next to our "internal discussion" rooms.
> > >>>> >    Cons: not open-source; we won't keep the chat history (1).
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > I created a poll based on the discussion we had on the thread
> > >>>> > "[hibernate-dev] Stride". I think everyone had the time to suggest
> > >>>> another
> > >>>> > option.
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > Please vote here and now, or remain silent forever ;):
> > >>>> > https://doodle.com/poll/h6scc9bsh6a4ymre
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > I'd suggest the following rules: if there's a single clear winner (a
> > >>>> > platform that everyone would be happy with), we'll pick that one. If
> > >>>> there
> > >>>> > are multiple clear winners, whoever does the migration work will
> > pick
> > >>>> > what's easier to set up (taking into account the various
> > >>>> integrations).
> > >>>> > Otherwise, back to discussing it on this thread...
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > (1) There seems to be some work in progress on a migration tool from
> > >>>> > HipChat to Zulip, but it doesn't seem to be ready yet [4]
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > [1]
> > >>>> >
> > >>>>
> > https://www.atlassian.com/partnerships/slack/faq#faq-da2b66a1-53d3-4c4e-a405-467d961336f7
> > >>>> > [2] https://www.atlassian.com/partnerships/slack/migration
> > >>>> > [3] https://hibernate.zulipchat.com/
> > >>>> > [4] https://github.com/zulip/zulip/issues/10647
> > >>>> > [5] https://gitter.im/hibernate/hibernate-orm
> > >>>> > [6] https://slackdemo.com/
> > >>>> >
> > >>>> > Yoann Rodière
> > >>>> > Hibernate NoORM Team
> > >>>> > yoann at hibernate.org
> > >>>> > _______________________________________________
> > >>>> > hibernate-dev mailing list
> > >>>> > hibernate-dev at lists.jboss.org
> > >>>> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev
> > >>>>
> > >>>> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> hibernate-dev mailing list
> > >>>> hibernate-dev at lists.jboss.org
> > >>>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > _______________________________________________
> > hibernate-dev mailing list
> > hibernate-dev at lists.jboss.org
> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev
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