4:27 p.m.
cc'ing gatein-dev on this email as other may have some options on this.
On Tue, 2012-04-10 at 18:40 -0300, Gabriel Cardoso wrote:
Hi Mark!
Its Matt :)
I took a look in your article. You told that "We should be
displaying and advertising that the site has alternative sites for different devices, so
it might not make sense to hide this in the footer area".
I agree that putting the link in the header is an effective advertising, but stepping
back, how interesting is for the users who are not using a mobile to know that now the
site supports mobile?
Something I do all the time on my tablet is switch between the 'mobile'
site and the desktop version of the site (mostly it's from mobile to
desktop since on most sites, their mobile version is meant for phones,
not tablets, and it a horrible experience). This comes down to user
preference.
The main usecase for this functionality is if I am on a phone and I go
to the site. For some reason my phone doesn't get detected as a mobile
device. Now I am on the desktop version of the site, on a phone, and its
a bad experience.
Since my phone didn't get detected as being a mobile device the first
time, I can't just dynamically display a link on the desktop site if I
think they are a mobile, since doing the detection again isn't going to
change anything.
So displaying the link now is for catching this error condition.
If I have a link at the top of the page (ideally near the top left),
then I can easily see on my phone that there is a site designed for my
device and I can hit the link to go there (discoverability)
If its in the footer, than I would have to scroll all the way through
the page and have to search for the link (and I would have to do this
blindly and assume there is such a link somewhere on the page, which may
or may not be true for most sites).
It also comes down to if I am on the mobile site and I click the link to
visit the main desktop site. I see that the desktop site doesn't work
properly at all on my tablet (maybe its heavily flash based). So now how
do I get back to the mobile site? Clicking the link changes the users
preference, so the next time they visit the site, they are going to be
redirected to the desktop based on this preference.
If anyone can come up with another way of handling these situations,
then maybe we don't need the redirect links in the header.
I believe that users should notice that a mobile version is available
when they access using a mobile. Beyond that, maybe it's useless information guided by
business goals.
If we think in this way, an interesting strategy is to show a link "Access the full
site" or "Desktop version" in the footer when the user is in the mobile
site. It's not necessary to show other links when he is in the desktop version.
But that's only my point of view. If showing the add to everybody is a business
requirement, I think your solution is perfect. If not, maybe we could do in a different
way.
What do you think?
Thanks,
Gabriel
11:05 p.m.
New subject: Mobile Manual Redirection Selection
Something I do all the time on my tablet is switch between the
'mobile'
site and the desktop version of the site (mostly it's from mobile to
desktop since on most sites, their mobile version is meant for phones,
not tablets, and it a horrible experience). This comes down to user
preference.
The main usecase for this functionality is if I am on a phone and I go
to the site. For some reason my phone doesn't get detected as a mobile
device. Now I am on the desktop version of the site, on a phone, and its
a bad experience.
Since my phone didn't get detected as being a mobile device the first
time, I can't just dynamically display a link on the desktop site if I
think they are a mobile, since doing the detection again isn't going to
change anything.
So displaying the link now is for catching this error condition.
Now it's clear
to me the importance of having a link to the mobile site in the desktop version :)
If I have a link at the top of the page (ideally near the top left),
then I can easily see on my phone that there is a site designed for my
device and I can hit the link to go there (discoverability)
Won't you probably
realize that the site is designed for your phone by observing that it's different from
the desktop version? I agree that the links at the top make it even clearer, but maybe
it's not a necessary condition for the discoverability.
If its in the footer, than I would have to scroll all the way
through
the page and have to search for the link (and I would have to do this
blindly and assume there is such a link somewhere on the page, which may
or may not be true for most sites).
By observing some big sites (like Facebook, I
realized that they often put this link in the footer. That's probably because they
assume that changing the site version is not the common action, but a exception. I agree
with this approach. If the site is not redirect properly redirected and the user realizes
that it is not well presented, he will look for a place to find a link to make the
change.
If anyone can come up with another way of handling these situations,
then maybe we don't need the redirect links in the header.
My main argument is
based in the users' behaviors. If the majority of our users (our main target) want to
switch between site versions often, so the links need to be highlighted (maybe in the
header). But if switching the site version is gonna be an exception (because the
redirection didn't work very well), than the links should be in a modest place (like
the footer). And even if most of people want to do it, once they have switched and
won't do it anymore, the links become a visual noise in the interface -- so it's
better to be in a more hidden place.
Thoughts?
Gabriel
1:39 p.m.
New subject: Mobile Manual Redirection Selection
AFAICT you can immediately recognize that you're using a mobile version of
the site on your phone.
First indication is normally URL - it contains m.something or
mobile.something or /mobile ...
But then immediately you see that fonts are big, there is less content on
one screen, navigation is simplified ... things like that.
Also it's become standard that you find a link to desktop version at the
bottom of the page.
These switcher links in the footer (Mobile | Desktop) should always be
present on all pages of the site be it desktop or mobile version, so you
can switch at any time. A click on this link should be considered a user
preference, and remembered, so that links to desktop version will
automatically redirect you to mobile version (only if the requested content
is available in mobile version I'd say), and when on mobile version you can
then click Desktop link to get a desktop version if that's what you want,
but this choice will then be remembered so next time you'll automatically
be redirected to desktop version.
I mostly use desktop versions of sites on my Nexus One - except for sites
that are too huge and take too long to render on the phone. And what I hate
the most is when I'm redirected to mobile version and and there's no
article there - either there's just a title and no content, or I'm actually
redirected to home page. Both of these are a waste of my time and causing
me to burn unnecessary data.
On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 11:05 PM, Gabriel Cardoso <gcardoso(a)redhat.com>wrote:
> Something I do all the time on my tablet is switch between the
'mobile'
> site and the desktop version of the site (mostly it's from mobile to
> desktop since on most sites, their mobile version is meant for phones,
> not tablets, and it a horrible experience). This comes down to user
> preference.
>
> The main usecase for this functionality is if I am on a phone and I go
> to the site. For some reason my phone doesn't get detected as a mobile
> device. Now I am on the desktop version of the site, on a phone, and its
> a bad experience.
> Since my phone didn't get detected as being a mobile device the first
> time, I can't just dynamically display a link on the desktop site if I
> think they are a mobile, since doing the detection again isn't going to
> change anything.
> So displaying the link now is for catching this error condition.
Now it's clear to me the importance of having a link to the mobile site in
the desktop version :)
> If I have a link at the top of the page (ideally near the top left),
> then I can easily see on my phone that there is a site designed for my
> device and I can hit the link to go there (discoverability)
Won't you probably realize that the site is designed for your phone by
observing that it's different from the desktop version? I agree that the
links at the top make it even clearer, but maybe it's not a necessary
condition for the discoverability.
> If its in the footer, than I would have to scroll all the way through
> the page and have to search for the link (and I would have to do this
> blindly and assume there is such a link somewhere on the page, which may
> or may not be true for most sites).
By observing some big sites (like Facebook, I realized that they often
put this link in the footer. That's probably because they assume that
changing the site version is not the common action, but a exception. I
agree with this approach. If the site is not redirect properly redirected
and the user realizes that it is not well presented, he will look for a
place to find a link to make the change.
> If anyone can come up with another way of handling these situations,
> then maybe we don't need the redirect links in the header.
My main argument is based in the users' behaviors. If the majority of our
users (our main target) want to switch between site versions often, so the
links need to be highlighted (maybe in the header). But if switching the
site version is gonna be an exception (because the redirection didn't work
very well), than the links should be in a modest place (like the footer).
And even if most of people want to do it, once they have switched and won't
do it anymore, the links become a visual noise in the interface -- so it's
better to be in a more hidden place.
Thoughts?
Gabriel
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gatein-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
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4:41 p.m.
New subject: Mobile Manual Redirection Selection
Ok, I guess a footer might be a better place to put the links/buttons
since it might be a widely acceptable practice.
On Thu, 2012-04-12 at 13:39 +0200, Marko Strukelj wrote:
AFAICT you can immediately recognize that you're using a mobile
version of
the site on your phone.
First indication is normally URL - it contains m.something or
mobile.something or /mobile ...
But then immediately you see that fonts are big, there is less content on
one screen, navigation is simplified ... things like that.
Also it's become standard that you find a link to desktop version at the
bottom of the page.
These switcher links in the footer (Mobile | Desktop) should always be
present on all pages of the site be it desktop or mobile version, so you
can switch at any time. A click on this link should be considered a user
preference, and remembered, so that links to desktop version will
automatically redirect you to mobile version (only if the requested content
is available in mobile version I'd say), and when on mobile version you can
then click Desktop link to get a desktop version if that's what you want,
but this choice will then be remembered so next time you'll automatically
be redirected to desktop version.
I mostly use desktop versions of sites on my Nexus One - except for sites
that are too huge and take too long to render on the phone. And what I hate
the most is when I'm redirected to mobile version and and there's no
article there - either there's just a title and no content, or I'm actually
redirected to home page. Both of these are a waste of my time and causing
me to burn unnecessary data.
On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 11:05 PM, Gabriel Cardoso <gcardoso(a)redhat.com>wrote:
> > Something I do all the time on my tablet is switch between the
'mobile'
> > site and the desktop version of the site (mostly it's from mobile to
> > desktop since on most sites, their mobile version is meant for phones,
> > not tablets, and it a horrible experience). This comes down to user
> > preference.
> >
> > The main usecase for this functionality is if I am on a phone and I go
> > to the site. For some reason my phone doesn't get detected as a mobile
> > device. Now I am on the desktop version of the site, on a phone, and its
> > a bad experience.
> > Since my phone didn't get detected as being a mobile device the first
> > time, I can't just dynamically display a link on the desktop site if I
> > think they are a mobile, since doing the detection again isn't going to
> > change anything.
> > So displaying the link now is for catching this error condition.
> Now it's clear to me the importance of having a link to the mobile site in
> the desktop version :)
>
> > If I have a link at the top of the page (ideally near the top left),
> > then I can easily see on my phone that there is a site designed for my
> > device and I can hit the link to go there (discoverability)
> Won't you probably realize that the site is designed for your phone by
> observing that it's different from the desktop version? I agree that the
> links at the top make it even clearer, but maybe it's not a necessary
> condition for the discoverability.
>
> > If its in the footer, than I would have to scroll all the way through
> > the page and have to search for the link (and I would have to do this
> > blindly and assume there is such a link somewhere on the page, which may
> > or may not be true for most sites).
> By observing some big sites (like Facebook, I realized that they often
> put this link in the footer. That's probably because they assume that
> changing the site version is not the common action, but a exception. I
> agree with this approach. If the site is not redirect properly redirected
> and the user realizes that it is not well presented, he will look for a
> place to find a link to make the change.
>
> > If anyone can come up with another way of handling these situations,
> > then maybe we don't need the redirect links in the header.
> My main argument is based in the users' behaviors. If the majority of our
> users (our main target) want to switch between site versions often, so the
> links need to be highlighted (maybe in the header). But if switching the
> site version is gonna be an exception (because the redirection didn't work
> very well), than the links should be in a modest place (like the footer).
> And even if most of people want to do it, once they have switched and won't
> do it anymore, the links become a visual noise in the interface -- so it's
> better to be in a more hidden place.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Gabriel
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> gatein-dev mailing list
> gatein-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/gatein-dev
>
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11:20 p.m.
New subject: Mobile Manual Redirection Selection
Ok, I guess a footer might be a better place to put the
links/buttons
since it might be a widely acceptable practice.
Here are mockups for the desktop and mobile versions with links at the footer.
> These switcher links in the footer (Mobile | Desktop) should
always be
> present on all pages of the site be it desktop or mobile version, so you
> can switch at any time.
If we are in the desktop version, does we need to show the link "Desktop"? I
believe only the "mobile" link would be sufficient.
Also, when the user is accessing the mobile version we should present only the link
"Desktop". This is also a common practice.
I made also some suggestions for the mobile homepage following some sign in patterns for
mobile.
What do you guys think about it?
Gabriel
On Apr 12, 2012, at 11:41 AM, Matt Wringe wrote:
Ok, I guess a footer might be a better place to put the
links/buttons
since it might be a widely acceptable practice.
>
> On Thu, 2012-04-12 at 13:39 +0200, Marko Strukelj wrote:
>> AFAICT you can immediately recognize that you're using a mobile version of
>> the site on your phone.
>>
>> First indication is normally URL - it contains m.something or
>> mobile.something or /mobile ...
>> But then immediately you see that fonts are big, there is less content on
>> one screen, navigation is simplified ... things like that.
>> Also it's become standard that you find a link to desktop version at the
>> bottom of the page.
>>
>> These switcher links in the footer (Mobile | Desktop) should always be
>> present on all pages of the site be it desktop or mobile version, so you
>> can switch at any time. A click on this link should be considered a user
>> preference, and remembered, so that links to desktop version will
>> automatically redirect you to mobile version (only if the requested content
>> is available in mobile version I'd say), and when on mobile version you can
>> then click Desktop link to get a desktop version if that's what you want,
>> but this choice will then be remembered so next time you'll automatically
>> be redirected to desktop version.
>>
>> I mostly use desktop versions of sites on my Nexus One - except for sites
>> that are too huge and take too long to render on the phone. And what I hate
>> the most is when I'm redirected to mobile version and and there's no
>> article there - either there's just a title and no content, or I'm
actually
>> redirected to home page. Both of these are a waste of my time and causing
>> me to burn unnecessary data.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 11:05 PM, Gabriel Cardoso
<gcardoso(a)redhat.com>wrote:
>>
>>>> Something I do all the time on my tablet is switch between the
'mobile'
>>>> site and the desktop version of the site (mostly it's from mobile to
>>>> desktop since on most sites, their mobile version is meant for phones,
>>>> not tablets, and it a horrible experience). This comes down to user
>>>> preference.
>>>>
>>>> The main usecase for this functionality is if I am on a phone and I go
>>>> to the site. For some reason my phone doesn't get detected as a
mobile
>>>> device. Now I am on the desktop version of the site, on a phone, and its
>>>> a bad experience.
>>>> Since my phone didn't get detected as being a mobile device the
first
>>>> time, I can't just dynamically display a link on the desktop site if
I
>>>> think they are a mobile, since doing the detection again isn't going
to
>>>> change anything.
>>>> So displaying the link now is for catching this error condition.
>>> Now it's clear to me the importance of having a link to the mobile site
in
>>> the desktop version :)
>>>
>>>> If I have a link at the top of the page (ideally near the top left),
>>>> then I can easily see on my phone that there is a site designed for my
>>>> device and I can hit the link to go there (discoverability)
>>> Won't you probably realize that the site is designed for your phone by
>>> observing that it's different from the desktop version? I agree that the
>>> links at the top make it even clearer, but maybe it's not a necessary
>>> condition for the discoverability.
>>>
>>>> If its in the footer, than I would have to scroll all the way through
>>>> the page and have to search for the link (and I would have to do this
>>>> blindly and assume there is such a link somewhere on the page, which may
>>>> or may not be true for most sites).
>>> By observing some big sites (like Facebook, I realized that they often
>>> put this link in the footer. That's probably because they assume that
>>> changing the site version is not the common action, but a exception. I
>>> agree with this approach. If the site is not redirect properly redirected
>>> and the user realizes that it is not well presented, he will look for a
>>> place to find a link to make the change.
>>>
>>>> If anyone can come up with another way of handling these situations,
>>>> then maybe we don't need the redirect links in the header.
>>> My main argument is based in the users' behaviors. If the majority of
our
>>> users (our main target) want to switch between site versions often, so the
>>> links need to be highlighted (maybe in the header). But if switching the
>>> site version is gonna be an exception (because the redirection didn't
work
>>> very well), than the links should be in a modest place (like the footer).
>>> And even if most of people want to do it, once they have switched and
won't
>>> do it anymore, the links become a visual noise in the interface -- so
it's
>>> better to be in a more hidden place.
>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>>>
>>> Gabriel
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> gatein-dev mailing list
>>> gatein-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/gatein-dev
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> gatein-dev mailing list
>> gatein-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/gatein-dev
>
>
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4 comments
3 participants
participants (3)
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Gabriel Cardoso -
Marko Strukelj -
Matt Wringe