[cdi-dev] Clarify scopes and serialization

Tue Feb 3 05:30:51 EST 2015

still dont get why you keep saying servlet spec assume serialization...

Romain Manni-Bucau
@rmannibucau
http://www.tomitribe.com
http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
https://github.com/rmannibucau

2015-02-03 11:30 GMT+01:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil at gmail.com>:
> That you'd have to ask the Servlet Spec Leads:
> https://jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=369
> As of now, it seems Tomitribe has no EG Member there, but I'm sure you could
> discuss anything with them if you feel it is a burden or makes no sense;-)
>
> Werner
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 11:24 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> point is while serialization itself is not specified you have no more
>> guarantee with Serializable. ATM you can serialize your bean
>> passivationId and keep your bean instance in memory (in a map). You
>> didnt serialize anything excepted a string!
>>
>> So why forcing such a constraint if it is an implementation detail?
>> Serialization process is not explicit so then constraint doesnt
>> guarantee any portability
>>
>>
>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>> @rmannibucau
>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>>
>>
>> 2015-02-03 11:22 GMT+01:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil at gmail.com>:
>> > Guess Jozef pretty much hit the point, I don't care about the sticker or
>> > label you may put on your laptop or product, but a compatible behavior
>> > allowing users to deploy against as many available containers as
>> > possible
>> > with minimal or no changes at all;-)
>> >
>> > On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 11:17 AM, Jozef Hartinger <jharting at redhat.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> If we want applications to be portable across different implementations
>> >> then the spec should require the least common multiple - that is beans
>> >> that
>> >> belong to passivating scopes being serializable. TomEE/OWB is free to
>> >> have a
>> >> mode in which passivation requirements are not checked if the server
>> >> runs in
>> >> non-passivating mode.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 02/03/2015 11:03 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> servlet spec requirement is only for distributed systems AFAIK == not
>> >>> required in most of instances.
>> >>> tomee supports both and is aligned on tomcat for all tomee flavors and
>> >>> is serialization-less in openejb flavors
>> >>>
>> >>> That said this is not a certification question but a usage question
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>> >>> @rmannibucau
>> >>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>> >>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>> >>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> 2015-02-03 10:59 GMT+01:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil at gmail.com>:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> What about TomEE?
>> >>>> After all it's Java EE 6 certified:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/javaee/overview/compatibility-jsp-136984.html
>> >>>>
>> >>>> So as Mark mentioned briefly, there is a requirement by the Servlet
>> >>>> spec, so
>> >>>> I assume it is either always on or at least on by default (otherwise
>> >>>> a
>> >>>> TomEE
>> >>>> "tweaked" like that would no longer be Java EE compliant;-)
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Tomcat itself was never certified.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Werner
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 9:39 AM, <cdi-dev-request at lists.jboss.org>
>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>
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>> >>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> >>>>> than "Re: Contents of cdi-dev digest..."
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Today's Topics:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>     1. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Mark Struberg)
>> >>>>>     2. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>> >>>>>     3. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Mark Struberg)
>> >>>>>     4. Re: Clarify scopes and serialization (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>> >>>>>     5. Re: Async events. We need ideas to improve CDI-499
>> >>>>>        (Jozef Hartinger)
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Message: 4
>> >>>>> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 16:50:44 +0100
>> >>>>> From: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau at gmail.com>
>> >>>>> Subject: Re: [cdi-dev] Clarify scopes and serialization
>> >>>>> To: Mark Struberg <struberg at yahoo.de>
>> >>>>> Cc: cdi-dev <cdi-dev at lists.jboss.org>
>> >>>>> Message-ID:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> <CACLE=7MUGeq_bgdx0W_hPT-15-9ae_XdD3kab0P3vE4YHftKRg at mail.gmail.com>
>> >>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> in a standard tomcat yes but not in most of embedded ones...and
>> >>>>> that's
>> >>>>> not the point anyway
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>> >>>>> @rmannibucau
>> >>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>> >>>>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>> >>>>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> 2015-02-02 16:50 GMT+01:00 Mark Struberg <struberg at yahoo.de>:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> but you HAVE to manually switch it off. By _default_ the
>> >>>>>> serialization
>> >>>>>> is on...
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> LieGrue,
>> >>>>>> strub
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> On Monday, 2 February 2015, 16:42, Romain Manni-Bucau
>> >>>>>>> <rmannibucau at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> @Mark: that's not true. 1) you can switch it off + I mainly spoke
>> >>>>>>>> of
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> embedded case where it is true in 80% of cases
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Romain Manni-Bucau
>> >>>>>>> @rmannibucau
>> >>>>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>> >>>>>>> http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com
>> >>>>>>> https://github.com/rmannibucau
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> 2015-02-02 16:38 GMT+01:00 Mark Struberg <struberg at yahoo.de>:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>   Romain, that's not true. Tomcat by default ALWAYS serializes
>> >>>>>>>> the
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> session at shutdown! Even if you don't have a cluster set up. This
>> >>>>>>> is
>> >>>>>>> also
>> >>>>>>> required by the Servlets spec...
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>   LieGrue,
>> >>>>>>>>   strub
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
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>> >>>>> End of cdi-dev Digest, Vol 51, Issue 4
>> >>>>> **************************************
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
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>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>
>