So you'd like JPA providers to read the JPA spec in a special "WildFly
light" wrt these quoted sections? Put aside your understanding that
WildFly suffers from this particular problem and point out the JPA spec
passages that say I need to delay using that BeanManager. In fact, I'd
argue the wording implies that the BeanManager should be usable
immediately upon being passed to the JPA provider.
On the flip side, is it possible that other containers might *only*
make the BeanManager available during bootstrap?
As for WildFly+Hibernate, I have already provided hooks to make sure
this can be done properly (albeit in non-spec way) as outlined in
On Mon 10 Jun 2013 04:54:22 PM CDT, Jason Greene wrote:
Right but my point is if the entities aren't instantiated, there
is nothing for the listener to listen for, and it can be delayed up until that point in
the deployment process.
It seems that the only hard ordering, is that the bean manager be created on top of
On Jun 10, 2013, at 4:41 PM, Steve Ebersole <steve(a)hibernate.org> wrote:
> We are talking about entity listeners, not entities. Entities can be annotated with
callback methods as well, but those are not supported (by spec) for CDI injection.
> BTW, for those maybe not familiar... The relevant sections in the JPA spec are:
> 9.1 Java EE Deployment. In this section, it discusses the expectations of the
container. In the part that discusses the call to createContainerEntityManagerFactory
(aka, bootstrapping an EntityManagerFactory) it says:
> If CDI is enabled, a BeanManager instance must be made available by the container.
> container is responsible for passing this BeanManager instance via the map that is
> an argument to the createContainerEntityManagerFactory call. The map key
> used must be the standard property name javax.persistence.bean.manager.
> And then, 3.5.1 Entity Listeners, as partially quote by Scott earlier.
> On Mon 10 Jun 2013 03:46:01 PM CDT, Jason Greene wrote:
>> I guess the point I am still not clear on is exactly when the entities are
instantiated. My understanding is that the earliest a user can cause a JPA impl load them
is inside a PostConstruct method. That is unless JPA providers load instances for some
kind of caching purposes?
>> On Jun 10, 2013, at 12:25 PM, Steve Ebersole <steve(a)hibernate.org> wrote:
>>> As Scott stated, Hibernate is doing the CDI calls as part of the
>>> EntityManagerFactory bootstrap (however that translates to WildFly
>>> deployment phases...). There is a difficulty with delaying these CDI
>>> calls. Getting around that would require either:
>>> 1) a 2-phase bootstrap process for the EntityManagerFactory. Even
>>> though that proposal was not accepted into the JPA spec, I went ahead
>>> and broke out Hibernate's bootstrapping into a 2-phase process, so
>>> WildFly (via jipijapa) could leverage that.
>>> 2) Creating proxies of the listeners that delegate to the real listeners
>>> and perform the init on first call. Ugh. Proxies calling proxies
>>> calling proxies... not a recipe for great performance. Not to mention
>>> don't call me to debug through that mess
>>> There is a third option. How entity listeners are built is hidden
>>> behind an interface (called ListenerFactory oddly enough). I can expose
>>> that as an integration point for WildFly to be able to plug in whatever
>>> "delayed init" scheme it deems appropriate. The only reason
>>> this is if y'all feel strongly about option 2 above (I'm not
>>> implementing that in the Hibernate code base). But my vote would be for
>>> the first option.
>>> I am open to other suggestions.
>>> On 06/10/2013 02:10 AM, Jozef Hartinger wrote:
>>>> Weld can be started before a JPA impl without a risk of suppressing
>>>> ClassFileTransformers under condition that all entities are annotated
>>>> with @Vetoed. We could document that as a requirement.
>>>> On 06/07/2013 06:20 PM, Scott Marlow wrote:
>>>>> For application deployments that use ClassFileTransformer to
>>>>> enhance/rewrite entity classes, we start the persistence unit
>>>>> (PersistenceProvider.createContainerEntityManagerFactory()) during
>>>>> Phase.FIRST_MODULE_USE (before any application classes have been
>>>>> For application deployments that have an explicit CDI Bean Manager,
>>>>> there is a beans.xml that means the ClassFileTransformer will not
>>>>> since the CDI Bean Manager will scan all of the application classes
>>>>> (loading them), before the persistence unit service is started (so
>>>>> the persistence provider can use CDI in entity listeners).
>>>>> The same is also true for implicit CDI Bean manager support ,
>>>>> all application deployments that contain an ejb3 module, will be
>>>>> for CDI (meaning JPA ClassFileTransformer support will work even
>>>>> I raised this on the JPA 2.1 EG  in response to an earlier
>>>>> discussion, about switching to a two phase approach to address
>>>>> like this (didn't discuss CDI implicit support then but am
>>>>>  talks about why we don't create the CDI bean managers before
>>>>> Install phase (would cause all application classes to be read which
>>>>> breaks JPA ClassFileTransformer use).
>>>>>  is for adding implicit CDI support but is blocked currently by
>>>>> We can add persistence unit flags
>>>>> for disabling JPA ClassFileTransformer support as a workaround but
>>>>> doesn't help enough since many deployments will have implicit
>>>>> support enabled (since they contain EJB modules). We could add a way
>>>>> disable implicit CDI support as another workaround for deployments
>>>>> want to use ClassFileTransformer.
>>>>> I'm not yet seeing a proper fix for this. Anyone else?
>>>>>  http://docs.jboss.org/cdi/spec/1.1/cdi-spec.html#bean_archive
>>>>>  https://issues.jboss.org/browse/WFLY-1322
>>>>>  https://issues.jboss.org/browse/WFLY-476
>>>>>  https://issues.jboss.org/browse/WFLY-1463
>>>>> wildfly-dev mailing list
>>>> wildfly-dev mailing list
>>> wildfly-dev mailing list
>> Jason T. Greene
>> WildFly Lead / JBoss EAP Platform Architect
>> JBoss, a division of Red Hat
Jason T. Greene
WildFly Lead / JBoss EAP Platform Architect
JBoss, a division of Red Hat