12:36 p.m.
Hi,
during experiments extending a generated aerogear application I found that
- the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda creative hack
- not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see above)
- does not make use of annotation driven UI/ser/deserializ. processing
During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern Jackson I realized, that Errai
is a very powerful and complete framework well worth being featured
in Forge's scaffold.
As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would like to ask for your opinion on
this.
Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an easy means to control the UI
/ (De-)Serialization, e.g. when working with entities, I think it is
necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation before deserialization, to avoid
loss of data if an incomplete entity is desrialized and persisted by
merge().
Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations into entity code - possibly by a
scaffold command like "scaffold applyAnnotations"?
In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice propagation for novices like
me.
Thanks,
Thomas
6:03 a.m.
Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in your poll.
Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an annotation that
know how to manage how to serialize persistent collection ??
In a way, are you talking about the problem that frameworks like Gilead try
to solve ??
2012/12/18 Thomas Frühbeck <fruehbeck(a)aon.at>
Hi,
during experiments extending a generated aerogear application I found that
- the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda creative hack
- not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see above)
- does not make use of annotation driven UI/ser/deserializ. processing
During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern Jackson I
realized, that Errai is a very powerful and complete framework well worth
being featured
in Forge's scaffold.
As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would like to ask for
your opinion on this.
Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an easy means to
control the UI / (De-)Serialization, e.g. when working with entities, I
think it is
necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation before
deserialization, to avoid loss of data if an incomplete entity is
desrialized and persisted by
merge().
Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations into entity code
- possibly by a scaffold command like "scaffold applyAnnotations"?
In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice propagation for
novices like me.
Thanks,
Thomas
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forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
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****************************************
7:55 a.m.
Sorry I was not up to the point, I am talking of current implementation of Aerogear
scaffold of Forge.
The question is: should Aerogear scaffold continue with Jackson or migrate to Errai?
Thomas
----- Ursprüngliche Nachricht -----
Von: "Luca Masini" luca.masini.mailing.list(a)gmail.com
Erhalten: 19.12.2012 13:03
An: "forge-dev List" forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in your poll.
Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an annotation that know how to
manage how to serialize persistent collection ??
8:53 a.m.
Jackson is a marshalling library for XML and JSON. Errai is a framework for building apps
that execute in the browser. I'm not sure you can replace one with the other.
On 19 Dec 2012, at 13:55, A-ON Puls Referenz-User wrote:
Sorry I was not up to the point, I am talking of current
implementation of Aerogear scaffold of Forge.
The question is: should Aerogear scaffold continue with Jackson or migrate to Errai?
Thomas
----- Ursprüngliche Nachricht -----
Von: "Luca Masini"
Erhalten: 19.12.2012 13:03
An: "forge-dev List"
Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in your poll.
Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an annotation that know how to
manage how to serialize persistent collection ??
In a way, are you talking about the problem that frameworks like Gilead try to solve ??
2012/12/18 Thomas Frühbeck < fruehbeck(a)aon.at >
Hi,
during experiments extending a generated aerogear application I found that
- the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda creative hack
- not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see above)
- does not make use of annotation driven UI/ser/deserializ. processing
During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern Jackson I realized, that
Errai is a very powerful and complete framework well worth being featured
in Forge's scaffold.
As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would like to ask for your opinion
on this.
Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an easy means to control the UI
/ (De-)Serialization, e.g. when working with entities, I think it is
necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation before deserialization, to avoid
loss of data if an incomplete entity is desrialized and persisted by
merge().
Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations into entity code - possibly by
a scaffold command like "scaffold applyAnnotations"?
In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice propagation for novices like
me.
Thanks,
Thomas
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2:41 p.m.
Pete I think that Thomas is talking about the marshalling protocol used by
Errai, you can use its own or one that is "jackson compatible".
I prefere the latter because I use JAX-RS services that produces JSON with
Jackson.
Ciao.
2012/12/19 Pete Muir <pmuir(a)redhat.com>
Jackson is a marshalling library for XML and JSON. Errai is a
framework
for building apps that execute in the browser. I'm not sure you can replace
one with the other.
On 19 Dec 2012, at 13:55, A-ON Puls Referenz-User wrote:
> Sorry I was not up to the point, I am talking of current implementation
of Aerogear scaffold of Forge.
>
> The question is: should Aerogear scaffold continue with Jackson or
migrate to Errai?
>
> Thomas
>
> ----- Ursprüngliche Nachricht -----
> Von: "Luca Masini"
> Erhalten: 19.12.2012 13:03
> An: "forge-dev List"
>
> Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in your poll.
>
> Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an annotation
that know how to manage how to serialize persistent collection ??
>
> In a way, are you talking about the problem that frameworks like Gilead
try to solve ??
>
>
> 2012/12/18 Thomas Frühbeck < fruehbeck(a)aon.at >
> Hi,
>
> during experiments extending a generated aerogear application I found
that
> - the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda creative hack
> - not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see above)
> - does not make use of annotation driven UI/ser/deserializ. processing
>
> During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern Jackson I
realized, that Errai is a very powerful and complete framework well worth
being featured
> in Forge's scaffold.
> As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would like to ask
for your opinion on this.
>
> Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
> Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an easy means
to control the UI / (De-)Serialization, e.g. when working with entities, I
think it is
> necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation before
deserialization, to avoid loss of data if an incomplete entity is
desrialized and persisted by
> merge().
>
> Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations into entity
code - possibly by a scaffold command like "scaffold applyAnnotations"?
>
> In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice propagation
for novices like me.
>
> Thanks,
> Thomas
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
>
>
> --
> ****************************************
> http://www.lucamasini.net
> http://twitter.com/lmasini
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/luca-masini/7/10/2b9
> ****************************************
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
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****************************************
3:44 p.m.
If I were given the choice, I would choose Errai + REST over pure JS +
REST. Try maintaining a 100,000+ line javascript app over multiple teams.
Good luck!
On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 3:41 PM, Luca Masini <
luca.masini.mailing.list(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Pete I think that Thomas is talking about the marshalling protocol
used by
Errai, you can use its own or one that is "jackson compatible".
I prefere the latter because I use JAX-RS services that produces JSON with
Jackson.
Ciao.
2012/12/19 Pete Muir <pmuir(a)redhat.com>
> Jackson is a marshalling library for XML and JSON. Errai is a framework
> for building apps that execute in the browser. I'm not sure you can replace
> one with the other.
>
> On 19 Dec 2012, at 13:55, A-ON Puls Referenz-User wrote:
>
> > Sorry I was not up to the point, I am talking of current implementation
> of Aerogear scaffold of Forge.
> >
> > The question is: should Aerogear scaffold continue with Jackson or
> migrate to Errai?
> >
> > Thomas
> >
> > ----- Ursprüngliche Nachricht -----
> > Von: "Luca Masini"
> > Erhalten: 19.12.2012 13:03
> > An: "forge-dev List"
> >
> > Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in your poll.
> >
> > Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an annotation
> that know how to manage how to serialize persistent collection ??
> >
> > In a way, are you talking about the problem that frameworks like Gilead
> try to solve ??
> >
> >
> > 2012/12/18 Thomas Frühbeck < fruehbeck(a)aon.at >
> > Hi,
> >
> > during experiments extending a generated aerogear application I found
> that
> > - the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda creative hack
> > - not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see above)
> > - does not make use of annotation driven UI/ser/deserializ. processing
> >
> > During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern Jackson I
> realized, that Errai is a very powerful and complete framework well worth
> being featured
> > in Forge's scaffold.
> > As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would like to ask
> for your opinion on this.
> >
> > Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
> > Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an easy means
> to control the UI / (De-)Serialization, e.g. when working with entities, I
> think it is
> > necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation before
> deserialization, to avoid loss of data if an incomplete entity is
> desrialized and persisted by
> > merge().
> >
> > Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations into entity
> code - possibly by a scaffold command like "scaffold applyAnnotations"?
> >
> > In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice propagation
> for novices like me.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Thomas
> > _______________________________________________
> > forge-dev mailing list
> > forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ****************************************
> > http://www.lucamasini.net
> > http://twitter.com/lmasini
> > http://www.linkedin.com/pub/luca-masini/7/10/2b9
> > ****************************************
> > _______________________________________________
> > forge-dev mailing list
> > forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
--
****************************************
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http://twitter.com/lmasini
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/luca-masini/7/10/2b9
****************************************
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http://ocpsoft.org
"Simpler is better."
6:22 p.m.
+1 to Errai+JS
Em 21/12/2012, às 19:44, "Lincoln Baxter, III" <lincolnbaxter(a)gmail.com>
escreveu:
If I were given the choice, I would choose Errai + REST over pure JS
+ REST. Try maintaining a 100,000+ line javascript app over multiple teams. Good luck!
On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 3:41 PM, Luca Masini <luca.masini.mailing.list(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> Pete I think that Thomas is talking about the marshalling protocol used by Errai, you
can use its own or one that is "jackson compatible".
>
> I prefere the latter because I use JAX-RS services that produces JSON with Jackson.
>
> Ciao.
>
>
> 2012/12/19 Pete Muir <pmuir(a)redhat.com>
>> Jackson is a marshalling library for XML and JSON. Errai is a framework for
building apps that execute in the browser. I'm not sure you can replace one with the
other.
>>
>> On 19 Dec 2012, at 13:55, A-ON Puls Referenz-User wrote:
>>
>> > Sorry I was not up to the point, I am talking of current implementation of
Aerogear scaffold of Forge.
>> >
>> > The question is: should Aerogear scaffold continue with Jackson or migrate
to Errai?
>> >
>> > Thomas
>> >
>> > ----- Ursprüngliche Nachricht -----
>> > Von: "Luca Masini"
>> > Erhalten: 19.12.2012 13:03
>> > An: "forge-dev List"
>> >
>> > Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in your poll.
>> >
>> > Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an annotation that
know how to manage how to serialize persistent collection ??
>> >
>> > In a way, are you talking about the problem that frameworks like Gilead try
to solve ??
>> >
>> >
>> > 2012/12/18 Thomas Frühbeck < fruehbeck(a)aon.at >
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > during experiments extending a generated aerogear application I found that
>> > - the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda creative hack
>> > - not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see above)
>> > - does not make use of annotation driven UI/ser/deserializ. processing
>> >
>> > During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern Jackson I
realized, that Errai is a very powerful and complete framework well worth being featured
>> > in Forge's scaffold.
>> > As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would like to ask for
your opinion on this.
>> >
>> > Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
>> > Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an easy means to
control the UI / (De-)Serialization, e.g. when working with entities, I think it is
>> > necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation before
deserialization, to avoid loss of data if an incomplete entity is desrialized and
persisted by
>> > merge().
>> >
>> > Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations into entity code -
possibly by a scaffold command like "scaffold applyAnnotations"?
>> >
>> > In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice propagation for
novices like me.
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Thomas
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > forge-dev mailing list
>> > forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > ****************************************
>> > http://www.lucamasini.net
>> > http://twitter.com/lmasini
>> > http://www.linkedin.com/pub/luca-masini/7/10/2b9
>> > ****************************************
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > forge-dev mailing list
>> > forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> forge-dev mailing list
>> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
>
>
> --
> ****************************************
> http://www.lucamasini.net
> http://twitter.com/lmasini
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/luca-masini/7/10/2b9
> ****************************************
>
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
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http://ocpsoft.org
"Simpler is better."
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2:13 a.m.
In fact, that's similar to what I was thinking of - just the other way
round: try maintaining 10+ projects of different clients with complex
entities and processes and different life cycles as a one man show with
handcrafted JS ;-)
That's what I'm going to be in to. Although I admit that Errai is quite
intimdating.
My next step will be to produce a showcase for Errai integration. Let's
see if I succeed.
Thanks for your comments.
Thomas
Am 21.12.2012 22:44, schrieb Lincoln Baxter, III:
If I were given the choice, I would choose Errai + REST over pure JS
+
REST. Try maintaining a 100,000+ line javascript app over multiple
teams. Good luck!
On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 3:41 PM, Luca Masini
<luca.masini.mailing.list(a)gmail.com
<mailto:luca.masini.mailing.list@gmail.com>> wrote:
Pete I think that Thomas is talking about the marshalling protocol
used by Errai, you can use its own or one that is "jackson
compatible".
I prefere the latter because I use JAX-RS services that produces
JSON with Jackson.
Ciao.
2012/12/19 Pete Muir <pmuir(a)redhat.com <mailto:pmuir@redhat.com>>
Jackson is a marshalling library for XML and JSON. Errai is a
framework for building apps that execute in the browser. I'm
not sure you can replace one with the other.
On 19 Dec 2012, at 13:55, A-ON Puls Referenz-User wrote:
> Sorry I was not up to the point, I am talking of current
implementation of Aerogear scaffold of Forge.
>
> The question is: should Aerogear scaffold continue with
Jackson or migrate to Errai?
>
> Thomas
>
> ----- Ursprüngliche Nachricht -----
> Von: "Luca Masini"
> Erhalten: 19.12.2012 13:03
> An: "forge-dev List"
>
> Hi Thomas, I didn't understand very well the question in
your poll.
>
> Anyway when you talk about the marshalling, do you mean an
annotation that know how to manage how to serialize persistent
collection ??
>
> In a way, are you talking about the problem that frameworks
like Gilead try to solve ??
>
>
> 2012/12/18 Thomas Frühbeck < fruehbeck(a)aon.at
<mailto:fruehbeck@aon.at> >
> Hi,
>
> during experiments extending a generated aerogear
application I found that
> - the current integration of JSON via Jackson is kinda
creative hack
> - not easily portable to recent releases of Jackson (see
above)
> - does not make use of annotation driven
UI/ser/deserializ. processing
>
> During my investigations on upgrade possibilities to modern
Jackson I realized, that Errai is a very powerful and complete
framework well worth being featured
> in Forge's scaffold.
> As I am not really deep into Jackson/JSON/Rest yet I would
like to ask for your opinion on this.
>
> Another question regarding use of annotations in a scaffold:
> Especially regarding modern Errai/Jackson annotations are an
easy means to control the UI / (De-)Serialization, e.g. when
working with entities, I think it is
> necessary to use persistence-based entity instantiation
before deserialization, to avoid loss of data if an incomplete
entity is desrialized and persisted by
> merge().
>
> Do you think it acceptable to actively insert annotations
into entity code - possibly by a scaffold command like
"scaffold applyAnnotations"?
>
> In my opinion this could provide interesting best practice
propagation for novices like me.
>
> Thanks,
> Thomas
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <mailto:forge-dev@lists.jboss.org>
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
>
>
>
> --
> ****************************************
> http://www.lucamasini.net
> http://twitter.com/lmasini
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/luca-masini/7/10/2b9
> ****************************************
> _______________________________________________
> forge-dev mailing list
> forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org <mailto:forge-dev@lists.jboss.org>
> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
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****************************************
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****************************************
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"Simpler is better."
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2:52 a.m.
Hi Thomas, we are using GWT from 2006 (a beta version 1.0) and we stopped
developing with pure JavaScript (not for Internet sites indeed), and from
there we developed about 200 Intranet applications with a very good impact
on management.
I think that handcrafted JS is not suitable for Enterprise.
About communication, we first used my own framework for JSON serialization (
http://code.google.com/p/productive-gwt/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fgwt-...)
but now I'm going to upgrade to Errai which is a framework that will us to
develop in an homogeneus way client/server.
And also I can stop mantaining that home made framework :)
Which kind of PoC do you plan to write ?
4:02 a.m.
Luca,
that's feedback I was hoping for :-)
My plans in short for aerogear-goes-errai:
- exchange Jackson ser/deser provider with Errai databinding for
entities
- create simple templated UI for entities
- extend entities with base set of annotations
- provide GWT compiler options in plugin (e.g. --style PRETTY)
Summary: produce a simple yet extendable app using Metawidget based
scaffolding mechanism "fromEntity"
Step 1: revamp a generated Aerogear app to use Errai - see the delta
Step 2: analyze possible improvements / best practices
Step 3: introduce experience into Metawidget scaffold
Step 4: implement forge commands for controlling generation/update of
source
Timeframe: Jan, 2013
It would be great to have you provide input e.g. on step 2, experience
is key in this step - and that's not what I can provide yet.
Regards,
Thomas
Am 22.12.2012 09:52, schrieb Luca Masini:
Hi Thomas, we are using GWT from 2006 (a beta version 1.0) and we
stopped developing with pure JavaScript (not for Internet sites
indeed), and from there we developed about 200 Intranet applications
with a very good impact on management.
I think that handcrafted JS is not suitable for Enterprise.
About communication, we first used my own framework for JSON
serialization
(http://code.google.com/p/productive-gwt/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fgwt-...)
but now I'm going to upgrade to Errai which is a framework that will
us to develop in an homogeneus way client/server.
And also I can stop mantaining that home made framework :)
Which kind of PoC do you plan to write ?
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing list
forge-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
6:50 a.m.
This couple be a very interesting example, I would look forward to a
write-up or blog about this.
Imo - both JS and GWT have their pros/cons so it would be good to compare.
On Sat, Dec 22, 2012 at 5:02 AM, Thomas Frühbeck <fruehbeck(a)aon.at> wrote:
Luca,
that's feedback I was hoping for :-)
My plans in short for aerogear-goes-errai:
- exchange Jackson ser/deser provider with Errai databinding for
entities
- create simple templated UI for entities
- extend entities with base set of annotations
- provide GWT compiler options in plugin (e.g. --style PRETTY)
Summary: produce a simple yet extendable app using Metawidget based
scaffolding mechanism "fromEntity"
Step 1: revamp a generated Aerogear app to use Errai - see the delta
Step 2: analyze possible improvements / best practices
Step 3: introduce experience into Metawidget scaffold
Step 4: implement forge commands for controlling generation/update of
source
Timeframe: Jan, 2013
It would be great to have you provide input e.g. on step 2, experience is
key in this step - and that's not what I can provide yet.
Regards,
Thomas
Am 22.12.2012 09:52, schrieb Luca Masini:
Hi Thomas, we are using GWT from 2006 (a beta version 1.0) and we stopped
developing with pure JavaScript (not for Internet sites indeed), and from
there we developed about 200 Intranet applications with a very good impact
on management.
I think that handcrafted JS is not suitable for Enterprise.
About communication, we first used my own framework for JSON
serialization (
http://code.google.com/p/productive-gwt/source/browse/#svn%2Ftrunk%2Fgwt-...)
but now I'm going to upgrade to Errai which is a framework that will us to
develop in an homogeneus way client/server.
And also I can stop mantaining that home made framework :)
Which kind of PoC do you plan to write ?
_______________________________________________
forge-dev mailing
listforge-dev@lists.jboss.orghttps://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/forge-dev
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10 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
A-ON Puls Referenz-User -
George Gastaldi -
Lincoln Baxter, III -
Luca Masini -
Pete Muir -
tech4j＠gmail.com -
Thomas Frühbeck