I am still confused what the issue is. Let's do this another way.
What do you propose as a solution for EE overall? Are you simply saying the current
proprietary ways of configuring executors are not good?
On Mar 7, 2016, at 8:39 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau
<rmannibucau(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2016-03-07 14:34 GMT+01:00 Reza Rahman <reza_rahman(a)lycos.com>:
> You've lost me.
>
> Are you talking about configuring what executors the container implementation itself
should use or what custom executors an application developer can use?
>
Both cases
> The best I can understand what your saying applies to the container implementation
itself. Then again, implementations like WebLogic, WebSphere and GlassFish allow you to
configure even the core executor pool of the runtime. It most certainly allows creating
custom executors pools.
>
> The only difference would be making what is vendor specific today completely
standardized. Since when is that a bad thing?
>
I'm for this standardization - even if just a subset of vendors config but the
minimum to ensure an app can scale on all servers. The bad thing is when the feature is
central or important for an app. Then you hide a proprietary feature behind a standard
API, this is very nasty and can lead to broken usages pretty easily.
However my last point is: even if you fix it for the container you still have the app use
cases where the pool are sometimes hidden in apps themself and EE concurrency doesn't
help there (and just taking few remote libs it is not rare at all).
>> On Mar 7, 2016, at 8:19 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>>
>> 2016-03-07 14:15 GMT+01:00 Reza Rahman <reza_rahman(a)lycos.com>:
>>> I am really confused now. Why shouldn't Java EE concurrency not be able
to define a standard way to configure custom executors? You can do that today, just in
vendor specific ways...
>>>
>>
>> Cause there are several libs where you don't control the pool and the best
you can do is to wrap the task (Runnable) on your side. Also you can hit it in background
threads you can't enforce to use concurrency spec and finally you can hit it in fully
synchronous way if you execute after the CDI chain - which is allowed by CDI and TCK-ed so
you can need a way to stack the context to reuse some part after. Last "?": JTA
integration: you can also hit it to save data after @TransactionScoped for audit
purposes.
>>
>>>> On Mar 7, 2016, at 5:10 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau
<rmannibucau(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2016-03-07 10:57 GMT+01:00 Martin Kouba <mkouba(a)redhat.com>:
>>>>> Dne 7.3.2016 v 09:45 Romain Manni-Bucau napsal(a):
>>>>>> 2016-03-07 9:07 GMT+01:00 Martin Kouba <mkouba(a)redhat.com
>>>>>> <mailto:mkouba@redhat.com>>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dne 7.3.2016 v 09:03 Romain Manni-Bucau napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Le 7 mars 2016 08:35, "Martin Kouba"
<mkouba(a)redhat.com
>>>>>> <mailto:mkouba@redhat.com>
>>>>>> <mailto:mkouba@redhat.com
<mailto:mkouba@redhat.com>>> a écrit :
>>>>>>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Dne 6.3.2016 v 15:39 Romain Manni-Bucau
napsal(a):
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >> Hi guys,
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> as a user having a ComlpetionStage makes me
loose some JDK
>>>>>> utilities,
>>>>>> >> can we move back to CompletionFuture?
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> It would allow for instance:
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> // doesn't work with CompletionStage
>>>>>> >> CompletionFuture.allOf(event1.fireAsync(...),
>>>>>> event2.fireAsync(...))
>>>>>> >> .then(...)
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Well, this should work if the underlying
CompletionStage impl
>>>>>> supports toCompletableFuture(), i.e. in Weld 3:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes but it is not natural to convert it IMO = we can do
better
>>>>>>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
CompletableFuture.allOf(event1.fireAsync(...).toCompletableFuture(),
>>>>>> event2.fireAsync(...).toCompletableFuture())
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > AFAIK the default async execution facility of
>>>>>> CompletableFuture is
>>>>>> ForkJoinPool.commonPool() which is not a good fit for
Java EE.
>>>>>> Using the
>>>>>> CompletionStage interface allows us to wrap the async
calls
>>>>>> without the
>>>>>> specified executor (e.g.
>>>>>> CompletionStage.thenApplyAsync(Function<? super
>>>>>> T, ? extends U>)) and supply a default one provided by
the impl.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Should use the pool in which the evznt is fired then
"then step" is
>>>>>> synchronous is my sample so all is decided at fire time
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't talk about your particular example - I understand
that it's
>>>>>> not using async exec (although the "then()" method
does not exist).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> was supposed to represent the different flavours (thenRun,
thenCompose,
>>>>>> ...) ;).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That said I agree on the state switching the pool is better but
with
>>>>>> these 2 notes:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - could be better to hide these poorly designed methods then
-> don't
>>>>>> use CompletionXXX but a CDI API with a bridge to CompletionX to
let the
>>>>>> user go back on SE tools
>>>>>
>>>>> Yep, this is one of the possible solutions. On the other hand, I
don't think it's poorly designed. CompletionStage defines the "default
asynchronous execution facility" and CDI spec states that the CompletionStage
returned by fireAsync methods is container-specific. The impl may choose to clarify this
"default asynchronous execution facility", i.e. there's place for
innovation...
>>>>>
>>>>>> - we still don't have a *standard* config for the pool(s)
underlying CDI
>>>>>> features so it sounds as poor as SE solution IMO (at least a
>>>>>> core/max/ttl config in beans.xml)
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't think this should be standardized...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Why? Typically if you take @Asynchronous (EJB spec) you have already this
issue and this is often avoided when portability matters for that particular reason you
don't know how you will behave. Or do you think concurrency-utilities solves it?
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> Romain Manni-Bucau
>>>>>> >> @rmannibucau
<
https://twitter.com/rmannibucau> | Blog
>>>>>> >> <
http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com> |
Github
>>>>>> >> <
https://github.com/rmannibucau> |
LinkedIn
>>>>>> >>
<
https://www.linkedin.com/in/rmannibucau> | Tomitriber
>>>>>> >> <
http://www.tomitribe.com>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >>
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>>>>>> >>
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>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> Note that for all code provided on this list,
the provider
>>>>>> licenses
>>>>>> the code under the Apache License, Version 2
>>>>>> (
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>>>>>> ideas
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>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > --
>>>>>> > Martin Kouba
>>>>>> > Software Engineer
>>>>>> > Red Hat, Czech Republic
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Martin Kouba
>>>>>> Software Engineer
>>>>>> Red Hat, Czech Republic
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Martin Kouba
>>>>> Software Engineer
>>>>> Red Hat, Czech Republic
>>>>
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