Well for whatever reason Antonio sounded rather uneasy about events. If
it's not size it must be for another reason, but take the idea of
optionality for things that might have a relatively large footprint in the
end.
Werner
On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 9:33 PM, <cdi-dev-request(a)lists.jboss.org> wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Time to start working on CDI lite (Romain Manni-Bucau)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 21:32:49 +0200
From: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau(a)gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [cdi-dev] Time to start working on CDI lite
To: Werner Keil <werner.keil(a)gmail.com>
Cc: cdi-dev <cdi-dev(a)lists.jboss.org>
Message-ID:
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
2015-08-30 21:20 GMT+02:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil(a)gmail.com>:
> Well if we found a way to offer some level of modularity and optionality
> (despite SE or EE 8 not putting a strong emphasis on either yet) I would
> certainly see it as an option. This could keep the size for some apps
down
> if they use other event systems already.
>
>
strictly yes, in practice the event bus is rarely more than few kb so does
it worth the time the EG would spend on it?
> Werner
>
> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 9:11 PM, <cdi-dev-request(a)lists.jboss.org>
wrote:
>
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>> Today's Topics:
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>> 1. Re: Time to start working on CDI lite (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 21:11:24 +0200
>> From: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau(a)gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [cdi-dev] Time to start working on CDI lite
>> To: Werner Keil <werner.keil(a)gmail.com>
>> Cc: cdi-dev <cdi-dev(a)lists.jboss.org>
>> Message-ID:
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>> 7PgKRmCrKiN1+xxLvqCtm3V1AE8D3c7kz_1W_wp1fuxkw(a)mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>>
>> 2015-08-30 20:29 GMT+02:00 Werner Keil <werner.keil(a)gmail.com>:
>>
>> > As there is well-established event handling on the SE and ME side, in
>> most
>> > cases based on java.util.EventObject, I could imagine CDI events being
>> > either outside a "lite" profile or at least optional, should we
consider
>> > optionality.
>> >
>> >
>> not sure I agree, SE has an event hierarchy but its listener model is
not
>> as usable as CDI most of the time because of the register side
>>
>>
>> > Werner
>> >
>> > On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 6:10 PM, <cdi-dev-request(a)lists.jboss.org>
>> wrote:
>> >
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>> >> Today's Topics:
>> >>
>> >> 1. Re: cdi-dev Digest, Vol 57, Issue 33 (Romain Manni-Bucau)
>> >> 2. Re: Time to start working on CDI lite (Antonio Goncalves)
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>
>> >> Message: 2
>> >> Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2015 18:09:41 +0200
>> >> From: Antonio Goncalves <antonio.goncalves(a)gmail.com>
>> >> Subject: Re: [cdi-dev] Time to start working on CDI lite
>> >> To: Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau(a)gmail.com>
>> >> Cc: cdi-dev <cdi-dev(a)lists.jboss.org>
>> >> Message-ID:
>> >> <CA+ZZq9-YFcTKuZr=+6v=
>> >> wH-w670E++qgBrN36DsToFEidUzenQ(a)mail.gmail.com>
>> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>> >>
>> >> For me, a Light version of CDI is clearly the features number.
That's
>> why
>> >> I
>> >> don't see events in it.
>> >>
>> >> For me, a CDI Lite would just focus on DI. If CDI has @Produces and
>> Spring
>> >> has @Bean, then it's because 330 lakes this functionality.
>> >>
>> >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 4:02 PM, Romain Manni-Bucau <
>> >> rmannibucau(a)gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Lite can have several definition, let's try to list them up if
it
can
>> >> help:
>> >> >
>> >> > - binary size: for me until 3M for an app it is "Lite"
>> >> > - features number: the whole IoC set of feature is light since
you
>> >> almost
>> >> > always need it, it means you can do lighter but it wouldnt be
used
-
>> >> check
>> >> > spring, who uses only spring-ioc and not context or more?
>> >> > - features complexity: sure we are not light here but supporting
>> scopes
>> >> > already breaks "Lite-ness" IMO so not a real issue
>> >> >
>> >> > So my view is CDI "SE" is light enough - as a spec and
spec can't
>> affect
>> >> > implementations so seems the fight is not on the right side to
me.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Romain Manni-Bucau
>> >> > @rmannibucau <
https://twitter.com/rmannibucau> | Blog
>> >> > <
http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com> | Github
>> >> > <
https://github.com/rmannibucau> | LinkedIn
>> >> > <
https://www.linkedin.com/in/rmannibucau> | Tomitriber
>> >> > <
http://www.tomitribe.com>
>> >> >
>> >> > 2015-08-30 15:57 GMT+02:00 Antonio Goncalves <
>> >> antonio.goncalves(a)gmail.com>
>> >> > :
>> >> >
>> >> >> It's funny, I feel I'm in Rod Johnson shoes back in
Java EE 6
where
>> he
>> >> >> forked 330 because he found CDI was doing too much ;o)
>> >> >>
>> >> >> For me, "CDI Lite" was just basic dependency
injection. The fact
>> that
>> >> CDI
>> >> >> can now run on SE (like JPA....), is good... but for me it
has
>> nothing
>> >> to
>> >> >> do with Light : it's the entire thing that can bootstrap
in SE.
>> Good.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> So what is Lite for you guys ?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Antonio
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 3:44 PM, Romain Manni-Bucau <
>> >> >> rmannibucau(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>> 2015-08-30 15:22 GMT+02:00 John D. Ament
<john.d.ament(a)gmail.com
>:
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> Personally, I'm not in favor of a slimmed down
runtime. It was
>> tried
>> >> >>>> with EJB, but never implemented properly (most
implementations
>> that
>> >> support
>> >> >>>> EJB-lite actually support the entire thing, except
for
deprecated
>> >> stuff).
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>> +1, most of CDI is basic and quickly any light version
will miss
>> >> events
>> >> >>> or other thing - in particular in maintaining micro
services from
>> >> >>> experience. Size of an implementation can easily be <
1M so not
>> sure
>> >> it
>> >> >>> would bring anything. Only important point is what
Antoine
started
>> to
>> >> do ie
>> >> >>> ensuring EE and SE parts are clearly identified and split
in the
>> spec.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>> I think if we define SE properly we won't have a
need for this.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> John
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 8:07 AM Antonio Goncalves
<
>> >> >>>> antonio.goncalves(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>> @Antoine, so which content do you see in CDI Lite
? Are you
sure
>> >> about
>> >> >>>>> events ?
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> I'm in favor of a "fatter" 330 that
would have :
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> - @Inject : already there
>> >> >>>>> - @Qualifier : already there
>> >> >>>>> -
>> >> >>>>> *Producers and disposers *
>> >> >>>>> -
>> >> >>>>> *Programatic lookup *
>> >> >>>>> - *Java SE Bootstrap*
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> When you say "*The goal here is not to
propose a new EE profile
>> but
>> >> a
>> >> >>>>> subspec*", 330 could already be seen as a
subspec. If you put
>> events
>> >> >>>>> apparts, what would be missing in this list in
your point of
>> view ?
>> >> And
>> >> >>>>> what obstacles do you see in archieving this ?
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> To boostrap CDI we have a CDIProvider, why not
having an
>> >> >>>>> InjectionProvider just to bootstrap 330 (then,
CDIProvider
could
>> >> extend
>> >> >>>>> InjectionProvider, so it bootstraps the all thing)
?
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> Antonio
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> On Sun, Aug 30, 2015 at 9:09 AM, Antoine
Sabot-Durand <
>> >> >>>>> antoine(a)sabot-durand.net> wrote:
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Yes Arjan, I think it's the first reason.
We really should
work
>> >> with
>> >> >>>>>> them to understand what should be added to CDI
2.0 to have it
>> as a
>> >> first
>> >> >>>>>> citizen DI in their spec.
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Le sam. 29 ao?t 2015 ? 23:15, arjan tijms
<
>> arjan.tijms(a)gmail.com>
>> >> a
>> >> >>>>>> ?crit :
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> On Sat, Aug 29, 2015 at 8:45 PM, Antonio
Goncalves
>> >> >>>>>>> <antonio.goncalves(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>> >> >>>>>>> > I remember talking with the JAX-RS
guys (Java EE), years
ago
>> >> (back
>> >> >>>>>>> in EE6),
>> >> >>>>>>> > and their answer for not adopting CDI
was "too heavy".
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> I can't find an exact reference
anymore, but I somewhat
>> remember
>> >> that
>> >> >>>>>>> one of the reasons was also simply that
CDI as a general
>> solution
>> >> >>>>>>> finished late in Java EE 6, while JAX-RS
finished earlier and
>> had
>> >> all
>> >> >>>>>>> the work for their own DI solution already
done.
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> --
>> >> >>>>> Antonio Goncalves
>> >> >>>>> Software architect, Java Champion and Pluralsight
author
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> Web site <
http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> |
Twitter
>> >> >>>>> <
http://twitter.com/agoncal> | LinkedIn
>> >> >>>>> <
http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> |
Pluralsight
>> >> >>>>> <
>>
http://pluralsight.com/training/Authors/Details/antonio-goncalves>
>> >> | Paris
>> >> >>>>> JUG <
http://www.parisjug.org> | Devoxx
France <
>>
http://www.devoxx.fr
>> >> >
>> >> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >> >>>>> cdi-dev mailing list
>> >> >>>>> cdi-dev(a)lists.jboss.org
>> >> >>>>>
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/cdi-dev
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>> Note that for all code provided on this list, the
provider
>> licenses
>> >> >>>>> the code under the Apache License, Version 2 (
>> >> >>>>>
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For all
other
>> >> ideas
>> >> >>>>> provided on this list, the provider waives all
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>> >> >>>>> intellectual property rights inherent in such
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>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >> >>>> cdi-dev mailing list
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>> >> >>
>> >> >> --
>> >> >> Antonio Goncalves
>> >> >> Software architect, Java Champion and Pluralsight author
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Web site <
http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter
>> >> >> <
http://twitter.com/agoncal> | LinkedIn
>> >> >> <
http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> | Pluralsight
>> >> >> <
http://pluralsight.com/training/Authors/Details/antonio-goncalves>
>> |
>> >> Paris
>> >> >> JUG <
http://www.parisjug.org> | Devoxx France <
http://www.devoxx.fr
>> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Antonio Goncalves
>> >> Software architect, Java Champion and Pluralsight author
>> >>
>> >> Web site <
http://www.antoniogoncalves.org> | Twitter
>> >> <
http://twitter.com/agoncal> | LinkedIn <
>> >>
http://www.linkedin.com/in/agoncal> |
>> >> Pluralsight
>> >>
<
http://pluralsight.com/training/Authors/Details/antonio-goncalves>
|
>> >> Paris
>> >> JUG <
http://www.parisjug.org> | Devoxx France
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