10:14 a.m.
On 6/8/12 2:31 AM, Max Rydahl Andersen wrote:
Hi Bill/David,
I unfortunately cannot use JBoss Logging yet because of how Eclipse plugins are built,
but
just a few observations on this "fun" topic ;)
Static vs non-static logging:
-------------------------------------
Eclipse plugins already are used to have to create a static string message in an
interface to do i18n of logging; they even provide tooling to make this easy to do - that
helps *alot*;
jboss logging doesn't have that though.
Now this is an interesting idea. I'll have to check out what they have.
Of course this sort of thing would probably be viewed as more
over-engineering by the FUD mongers :)
Unfortunately we actually in Eclipse world also have the non-interface based stuff too
that Bill wants and yes its awesome you can just write it quick'n'dirty but maan
its a mess to work with
afterwards over time. (In resteasy you probably don't see it because its much smaller
than the number of eclipse plugins we have to maintain, but if I could choose now, I would
like
to have that stick hit me everytime I was lazy)
Hacker tip: Nothing prevents you from doing a generic highlevel interface field you can
use everytime you are feeling lazy - good thing is you or others can easily find the
usages of that
and go through and convert these messages. just saying.
Performance:
-------------------
Jason and David aren't full of shit here.
They proved early on in AS7 lifetime that even basic stuff in logging like checking if
log is activated was costing as much as 10% overhead - even with logging disabled. That
was before string concatenation gets into play.
And if you don't trust them then I can tell you Eclipse went through the exact same
exercise some years back. They had grown organically over time from a few small plugins to
thousands. and suddenly they
were faced with several hundred megabytes of overhead and a sluggish performance. Their
move to use static interfaces made a big impact in runtime performance AND memory usage.
JBoss Logging actually takes this even further - but i'll leave David and Jasons to
explain those :)
Usability:
-------------
You do not need an additional maven plugin if you just use the plain standard annotation
processor.
You keep saying you need one so i'm curious why you think that.
There is though one place where this annotation processor sucks, and that is that it
isn't isolated
enough to be reusable and runnable within an IDE such as Eclipse :)
https://issues.jboss.org/browse/LOGTOOL-51 captures that; this shouldn't affect you
though since you
are just using maven and vi.
That needs to be fixed. Really we need to disable JAXP redirection by
default in jboss modules. It's not an absolute necessity. I'll work on a
patch for that.
....and I'm all for that beer too - can we talk about how JBoss Logging could be made
to work with Eclipse logging framework ? :)
Sure! :)
/max
On 08 Jun 2012, at 00:43, Bill Burke wrote:
>
>
> On 6/7/12 6:21 PM, David M. Lloyd wrote:
>> On 06/07/2012 04:55 PM, Bill Burke wrote:
>>>
>>> P.S. I hope we can have a few beers at JUDCon/JBossWorld and *NOT* talk
>>> about this.
>>
>> :-D
>>
>> Don't get me wrong, I'm not pissed or anything. I do love a good
>> argument though.
>>
>
> Oh thank god! I love a good argument too! I don't know about you, but
> sitting at home every day, you get a bit ornery....
>
> I've exhausted my arguments anyways. Hopefully Jim can take the banner
> and run with it...
>
> --
> Bill Burke
> JBoss, a division of Red Hat
> http://bill.burkecentral.com
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Jason T. Greene
JBoss AS Lead / EAP Platform Architect
JBoss, a division of Red Hat