"gavin.king(a)jboss.com" wrote : Well, basically, I think these problem becomes much easier once you stop thinking in terms of "what layers should I have", and start thinking in terms of "what code do I have that is reusable when the client is not JSF, and what code do I have that is not reusable?", and then implement the reusable code into reusable Seam components. | | This doesn't stop you from thinking about component dependencies, and about separation of concerns - in fact it makes it easier. | | It's my strong belief that conceptualizing reusability in terms of "layers" has been the source of much evil in the Java world. I try to write reusable objects, not reusable layers. But this is not an approach that Seam forces upon you, it is just my approach. That's an interesting way to look at it. Do you feel you could say the same for loose-coupling, maintainability, scalability, and all of the arguments people give for layering? Perhaps it's hard for people to see that a lot of the old-school layering techniques are done for you under the covers with Seam, and feel like they're taking the "red pill" by not self-imposing their own layers. View the original post : http://www.jboss.com/index.html?module=bb&op=viewtopic&p=4057891#... Reply to the post : http://www.jboss.com/index.html?module=bb&op=posting&mode=reply&a...