Re: [hibernate-dev] Chat migration - D minus 115 until the death of HipChat

Hi, So, one thing I find particularly annoying with Gitter now that we are trying to use it for real interactions is the lack of notification sounds in the webapp. When you're focused on your work, it's really easy to miss the visual ones and having a sound really helped on HipChat. There is an open issue here: https://gitlab.com/gitlab-org/gitter/webapp/issues/735 . AFAICS in the commit log, there's one person working on Gitter and it's not making tremendous progress. (Yeah, I know, it's Open Source, I can contribute...) -- Guillaume On Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 3:47 PM Yoann Rodiere <yoann(a)hibernate.org&gt; wrote: > Hi, > > TL;DR: I created the Gitter rooms. Let's all go there for a few days, at > least to try it? > > *Connecting* > > Obviously you can just connect to https://gitter.im/ and use the browser. > You can sign in with your Github, Gitlab or Twitter account. > > There are also desktop/mobile applications. https://gitter.im/apps > They only provide .deb packages, though, and I wasn't able to convert them > easily using alien (I didn't try very hard). There is a snap out there, but > it's an old version that isn't allow to use the Gitter APIs anymore. > > If you prefer to use IRC, they apparently provide a bridge. I don't know > what it's worth, but you can always give it a try: see > https://irc.gitter.im/ . > > *What's next?* > > Let's try to use it for a few days, see if everyone is comfortable with it? > Let's see if there isn't any blocker for anyone, and if the news from other > projects (such as WildFly moving to Slack) don't make use change our minds. > > Then if everyone is okay with it, we can finalize everything: > > - Invite external people to our rooms (I didn't invite anyone except our > own team) > - Advertise Gitter as our main chat platform: > - On our websites > - On IRC (we should at least mention it in the "message of the day") > - On the hibernate-announce mailing list > - In the REAME file of our projects through a badge: []( > https://gitter.im/hibernate/hibernate-room-id > ?utm_source=badge&utm_medium=badge&utm_campaign=pr-badge) > - Close the HipChat rooms somehow. > > *Available rooms* > > For each of our main projects, I created one room bound to the GitHub > repository for users, and *one *-dev room for our own use*. > I also created rooms based on what I could see in HipChat (branding, ...). > > You can find a list of all rooms here: https://gitter.im/hibernate/home > > I already added people according to which room they were member of in > HipChat, but I may have missed some. Please check which room you are > subscribed to. > > *Settings* > > You can configure how often you want to be notified for each room: go to > the room, click on the "settings" button next to your avatar on the top > right, then "Notifications". > In this same popup, you have the option of setting general defaults. > > Also, a dark theme is available: click on your avatar on the top right, > then "Toggle Dark Theme". > > That's pretty much it. > > *Configuring your rooms* > > I configured the main rooms to receive Github notifications on the > "activity tab" to the right, as well as Jenkins notifications for the > "master" and "PR" job (when I found it). Feel free to add more integration > if you want to. > > How to add a Jenkins integration: > > - If your room doesn't have a Jenkins integration yet (most have): > - Go to the room on Gitter > - Click on the "settings" button next to your avatar on the top > right, then "Integrations". > - Select "Jenkins" > - Select the events you want to be notified of > - Copy the webhook URL near the bottom > - Create new credentials on Jenkins: > > http://ci.hibernate.org/credentials/store/system/domain/_/newCredentials > - In the "Kind" field, select "Secret text" > - Leave the "Scope" to "Global" > - In the "Secret" field, paste the webhook URL > - In the "ID" field, put "gitter-webhook-url-<ID of your room>" > - In the "description" field, put "Gitter webhook URL for the <ID > of your room> room" > - Click "OK" > - For each Jenkins job: > - On the job page in Jenkins, click "Configure" > - Select the "Job Notifications" tab near the top > - Click "Add endpoint" > - Leave the format to "JSON" and the protocol to "HTTP" > - Set "URL Source" to "Credentials Store" > - In the "URL" box, select the entry corresponding to your room, > which should normally appear as "Gitter webhook URL for the <ID of > your room> room" > - Click "Save" > > > > Hibernate NoORM Team > yoann(a)hibernate.org > > > On Tue, 6 Nov 2018 at 11:40, Yoann Rodiere <yoann(a)hibernate.org&gt; wrote: > > > I think all day-to-day users of our chat voted. Here are the results: > > > > IRC: 4 Yes, 5 "if need be", 6 no. > > Slack: 5 Yes, 3 "if need be", 7 no > > Zulip: 5 Yes, 3 "if need be", 7 no > > Gitter: 10 Yes, 1 "if need be", 4 no > > > > It seems Gitter won. That's the only option with more "Yes" than "No"... > > It's got the most "Yes" (even counting "if need be"), and perhaps more > > importantly it's got the least amount of "no". > > > > To those who voted no: if you have specific concerns about Gitter, could > > you please mention them here? Maybe we can find solutions to some of the > > problems. > > > > I'll look into moving the Hibernate Search chat to Gitter and will report > > back on this thread. > > > > Yoann Rodière > > Hibernate NoORM Team > > yoann(a)hibernate.org > > > > > > On Mon, 5 Nov 2018 at 08:25, Yoann Rodiere <yoann(a)hibernate.org&gt; wrote: > > > >> Not everyone voted, far from it; we're missing votes from Gail, > >> Guillaume, Fabio, Chris, Davide, Emmanuel, Koen. So no, no consensus > yet. > >> > >> I sent an email to them off-list, perhaps they didn't see this thread. > >> > >> Provisional results are as follows: > >> > >> IRC: 2 Yes, 3 "if need be", 3 no > >> Slack: 2 Yes, 2 "if need be", 4 no > >> Zulip: 2 Yes, 3 "if need be", 3 no > >> Gitter: 6 Yes, 0 "if need be", 2 no > >> > >> So Gitter seems on the verge of winning, but apparently some people are > >> categorically against it, so I'd say we'll have to give them a chance to > >> explain why. I'll wait for everyone to answer, though, since they could > >> completely change the results. > >> > >> Yoann Rodière > >> Hibernate NoORM Team > >> yoann(a)hibernate.org > >> > >> > >> On Sat, 3 Nov 2018 at 13:35, Steve Ebersole <steve(a)hibernate.org&gt; > wrote: > >> > >>> Any consensus on this yet? > >>> > >>> On Tue, Oct 23, 2018 at 5:21 AM Sanne Grinovero <sanne(a)hibernate.org&gt; > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Thanks for starting this! > >>>> > >>>> The choice of IRC is a bit special on the list as we never intended it > >>>> to be killed: it has been historically important and we should > >>>> maintain some level of reachability on it. So voting for the "IRC" > >>>> choice just means a preference to not use anything else on top of it, > >>>> while alternatively we'' be using X on top of IRC, albeit with a > >>>> preference to use X for team conversations. > >>>> > >>>> Also good to remind: please try to be on IRC as well occasionally as > >>>> many in the OSS community we integrate with will reach out there. > >>>> > >>>> Thanks, > >>>> Sanne > >>>> > >>>> On Tue, 23 Oct 2018 at 09:46, Yoann Rodiere <yoann(a)hibernate.org&gt; > >>>> wrote: > >>>> > > >>>> > Hi, > >>>> > > >>>> > TL;DR: please vote here if you don't want to end up having to use a > >>>> chat > >>>> > tool you don't like: https://doodle.com/poll/h6scc9bsh6a4ymre > >>>> > > >>>> > HipChat Cloud will stop working on February 15th, 2019 [1]. We need > to > >>>> > choose an alternative before we have our back against the wall, so > >>>> I'll try > >>>> > to resurrect the conversation. > >>>> > > >>>> > As a reminder, Stride is no longer an option: Atlassian cancelled > the > >>>> > project, and encourages users to migrate to Slack. > >>>> > > >>>> > The discussed options so far were: > >>>> > > >>>> > - *Moving back to IRC*. Aye: ?; nay: ? > >>>> > Pros: simple as hell. > >>>> > Cons: basic as hell; we won't keep the chat history. > >>>> > - *Migrating to Slack* [6], as suggested by Atlassian [2]. Aye: > >>>> > Christian B; Nay: ? > >>>> > Pros: we will keep the chat history (I think). > >>>> > Cons: not open-source; desktop client consumes a lot of > resources. > >>>> > - *Migrating to Zulip* [3]. Aye: Emmanuel, Yoann. Nay: Guillaume > >>>> (kind > >>>> > of). > >>>> > Pros: Advanced conversation management thanks to the "topics" > >>>> feature. > >>>> > Cons: Complex to use because of the "topics" feature; we won't > >>>> keep the > >>>> > chat history (1). > >>>> > - *Migrating to Gitter* [5] (we'll create different rooms, > >>>> probably). > >>>> > Aye: ?, Nay: ? > >>>> > Pros: Users seem to actually go there, so we could have our "live > >>>> > support" rooms next to our "internal discussion" rooms. > >>>> > Cons: not open-source; we won't keep the chat history (1). > >>>> > > >>>> > I created a poll based on the discussion we had on the thread > >>>> > "[hibernate-dev] Stride". I think everyone had the time to suggest > >>>> another > >>>> > option. > >>>> > > >>>> > Please vote here and now, or remain silent forever ;): > >>>> > https://doodle.com/poll/h6scc9bsh6a4ymre > >>>> > > >>>> > I'd suggest the following rules: if there's a single clear winner (a > >>>> > platform that everyone would be happy with), we'll pick that one. If > >>>> there > >>>> > are multiple clear winners, whoever does the migration work will > pick > >>>> > what's easier to set up (taking into account the various > >>>> integrations). > >>>> > Otherwise, back to discussing it on this thread... > >>>> > > >>>> > (1) There seems to be some work in progress on a migration tool from > >>>> > HipChat to Zulip, but it doesn't seem to be ready yet [4] > >>>> > > >>>> > [1] > >>>> > > >>>> > https://www.atlassian.com/partnerships/slack/faq#faq-da2b66a1-53d3-4c4e-a... > >>>> > [2] https://www.atlassian.com/partnerships/slack/migration > >>>> > [3] https://hibernate.zulipchat.com/ > >>>> > [4] https://github.com/zulip/zulip/issues/10647 > >>>> > [5] https://gitter.im/hibernate/hibernate-orm > >>>> > [6] https://slackdemo.com/ > >>>> > > >>>> > Yoann Rodière > >>>> > Hibernate NoORM Team > >>>> > yoann(a)hibernate.org > >>>> > _______________________________________________ > >>>> > hibernate-dev mailing list > >>>> > hibernate-dev(a)lists.jboss.org > >>>> > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev > >>>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>> hibernate-dev mailing list > >>>> hibernate-dev(a)lists.jboss.org > >>>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ > hibernate-dev mailing list > hibernate-dev(a)lists.jboss.org > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev _______________________________________________ hibernate-dev mailing list hibernate-dev(a)lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/hibernate-dev