Can't you just use small words for those of us that aren't deployment
experts? :)
On May 5, 2008, at 2:24 PM, David M. Lloyd wrote:
Yeah, this is the exact basis of my idea to make emulation APIs for
AS/MC deployments. We could provide APIs for every logging
framework known to mankind, including multiple versions of the same
framework if they happen to be incompatible (if we do our
deployments correctly anyway).
Then the user just has to specify what logging API they use in their
deployment somehow (it would be cool if we could just dynamically
sniff out that info). As Scott pointed out, we also would need a
way to parse all the different logging config formats. Which pretty
much brings us up to date. :-)
- DML
On 05/05/2008 02:17 PM, Steve Ebersole wrote:
> Another option might be dynamic replacement of the logging
> framework with a different impl altogether. There is an example of
> this in allowing code using commons-logging to remain unchanged,
> and a different implementation of the commons-logging APIs to be
> substituted with slf4j logging:
http://day-to-day-stuff.blogspot.com/2007/07/no-more-commons-logging.html
> In fact I use this setup already in the hibernate testsuite to
> account for other libraries (commons-collections, etc) which use
> commons-logging and have them dynamically use my slf4j setup.
> On May 5, 2008, at 8:11 AM, David M. Lloyd wrote:
>> I'm a bit hazy on the details but I understand that some logging
>> frameworks allow you to subclass a base logger class, and some
>> don't - so if you do so it's really difficult to properly weave in
>> the appropriate substitution. Last time I heard, Trustin still
>> didn't have a solution to the problem.
>>
>> Have you already made the switch to JDK logging in the jbossas
>> core? If so, is there a sensible LogManager yet?
>>
>> Also, do we need to do anything funky like support different
>> configurations on a per-deployment basis? I am under the
>> impression that Glassfish does this, but I haven't figured out the
>> details yet.
>>
>> For configurations, I get what you're saying - though I imagine
>> there's probably users out there who want to use their own logging
>> framework and configuration in certain deployments, so I think
>> we'd need a way to support that - maybe just by detecting the
>> presence of a logging implementation in the deployment or something.
>>
>> Otherwise, based on what I know of the various logging
>> configuration formats, we could probably just rewrite the logging
>> configuration into a bean deployment that just uses the JDK
>> logging API to acquire and configure Logger and Handler instances,
>> rather than try to use the stupid properties system that the
>> default LogManager uses.
>>
>> - DML
>>
>> On 05/04/2008 02:42 PM, Scott Stark wrote:
>>> All that I can recall as a reasonable compromise was to simply
>>> move to the jdk logging with the replacement logging handlers
>>> based on the log4j type of appenders I ported over when
>>> previously looking at this problem. Trustin has since introduced
>>> log2log, we could always use jboss retro to map framework X onto
>>> the jbossas core, but that does not cover the framwork X
>>> configuration files.
>>> How I can see the mc and jbossas deployment framework fitting in
>>> is by rewriting the logging system X config files onto the
>>> current jbossas implementation if that is desired. The problem
>>> always is whether the logging in question is part of a user
>>> application, or a jbossas framework. In reality I only see jdk
>>> logging for the server frameworks and other frameworks wanting to
>>> integrate with the server logs having a jdk logger option, or an
>>> adaptor.
>>> What are the log2log issues showing up?
>>> David M. Lloyd wrote:
>>>> Well, that's a good project, but bytecode weaving seems like a
>>>> pretty heavy-duty solution to a simple problem.
>>>>
>>>> The basic problem is, people (within JBoss and without) are
>>>> going to use the frameworks they're going to use. How much
>>>> effort is it to adapt log2log (which has already run into some
>>>> interesting technical dilemmas) to another framework, versus
>>>> just adding another API facade? It seems like the
>>>> microcontainer arch would be perfectly suited towards auto-
>>>> wiring the appropriate logging API.
>>>>
>>>> Wouldn't it be nice if we could say, "deploy your app in
JBossAS/
>>>> JBossMC and it will *just work*, regardless of what logging
>>>> frameworks are being used by what"?
>>>>
>>>> - DML
>>>>
>>>> On 05/02/2008 01:41 PM, Ales Justin wrote:
>>>>> What about if we used this:
>>>>> -
https://svn.jboss.org/repos/log2log/trunk
>>>>> with-in one of our deployers, and you could mark certain
>>>>> deployments as being 'dragged' through Log2Log to
'clean-up'
>>>>> logging?
>>>>>
>>>>> Steve Ebersole wrote:
>>>>>> I apologize for the tone in my last response. The original
>>>>>> thread was frustrating enough, and here it is being relived.
>>>>>> I let that frustration get to me when I should not have.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On May 2, 2008, at 12:12 PM, Steve Ebersole wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I cannot help that AS seems to think that every piece of
>>>>>>> technology needs to be complete re-written in house.
Y'all
>>>>>>> have you're own logging framework, great, add it to the
other
>>>>>>> 50 out there.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The part that you are missing is that Hibernate is first and
>>>>>>> foremost a standalone library. And in terms of integration,
>>>>>>> I have to consider integration with many containers. I'm
>>>>>>> sure they all want jboss-logging as the 'yet another
logging
>>>>>>> api' in their environments as well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I used to use commons-logging which had a very specific
>>>>>>> problem that slf4j solves in a unique way *on any
platform*...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you recall, I asked about experiences using jboss-logging
>>>>>>> in environments other than within JBoss AS and (in keeping
>>>>>>> with the general theme of that thread) got no replies to the
>>>>>>> question asked:
http://lists.jboss.org/pipermail/jboss-development/2007-July/010398.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On May 2, 2008, at 11:30 AM, Scott Stark wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And we said sure, introduce yet another logging api?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Steve Ebersole wrote:
>>>>>>>>> I initiated that very discussion on this very list
almost a
>>>>>>>>> year ago ;)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On May 2, 2008, at 11:15 AM, Paul Gier wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I upgraded this based on JBAS-5133 and
Steve's request. I
>>>>>>>>>> can switch it back to the old version if
that's what is
>>>>>>>>>> needed.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Scott Stark wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Why was hibernate updated to 3.3.0 in jbossas
trunk, and
>>>>>>>>>>> why is this pulling in yet another logging
framework?
>>>>>>>>>>> This needs to be reverted, and why there has
to be yet
>>>>>>>>>>> another logging framework dependency brought
in explained.
>>>>>>>>>>> *** CONTEXTS IN ERROR: Name -> Error
>>>>>>>>>>>
vfsfile:/media/disk/workspace/tck5/jboss-5.0.0.CR1/server/
>>>>>>>>>>>
cts/tmp/jsr88/ejb3_annotations_entity_vehicles.ear ->
>>>>>>>>>>> java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError:
org/slf4j/LoggerFactory
>>>>>>>>>>>
_______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>> jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org
>>>>>>>>>>>
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------
>>>>>>>>> Steve Ebersole
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Project Lead
>>>>>>>>>
http://hibernate.org
>>>>>>>>> steve(a)hibernate.org
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>
https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----------------------------
>>>>>>> Steve Ebersole
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Project Lead
>>>>>>>
http://hibernate.org
>>>>>>> steve(a)hibernate.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----------------------------
>>>>>> Steve Ebersole
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Project Lead
>>>>>>
http://hibernate.org
>>>>>> steve(a)hibernate.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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> -----------------------------
> Steve Ebersole
> Project Lead
>
http://hibernate.org
> steve(a)hibernate.org
> _______________________________________________
> jboss-development mailing list
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>
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