As part of the development of JBoss Messaging 2.0 we need the jbossas 5 core-libs. Is there any possibility of making a snapshot of these available in the repository?

currently we're pulling in http://repository.jboss.com/jbossas/core-libs/4.2.2.GA/ this is because as you stay we are deployable standalone and need these libraries.

Ales Justin wrote: > Which core libs? > > Sounds like you're not using integration project? :-) > > Since I guess that's the way to do it, if you want to have it > standalone or used in different env than JBossAS. > > But you probably require a bunch on non existing integration pieces. :-) > > Andy Taylor wrote: >> As part of the development of JBoss Messaging 2.0 we need the jbossas >> 5 core-libs. Is there any possibility of making a snapshot of these >> available in the repository? > _______________________________________________ > jboss-development mailing list > jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

This is currently how we do it in JBM 1.4. Is there a Wiki page explaining the correct way to integrate jbossas dependencies?

Adrian wrote: > On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 10:40 +0000, Andy Taylor wrote: > >> currently we're pulling in >> http://repository.jboss.com/jbossas/core-libs/4.2.2.GA/ this is because >> as you stay we are deployable standalone and need these libraries. >> >> > > That's a different issue to what you should be compiling over. > > You should be compiling over the integration project and letting > jboss-4.2.x, 5.0.x or jboss embedded (which is what you should > really be using as a standalone runtime) implement them how it > likes. > > >> Ales Justin wrote: >> >>> Which core libs? >>> >>> Sounds like you're not using integration project? :-) >>> >>> Since I guess that's the way to do it, if you want to have it >>> standalone or used in different env than JBossAS. >>> >>> But you probably require a bunch on non existing integration pieces. :-) >>> >>> Andy Taylor wrote: >>> >>>> As part of the development of JBoss Messaging 2.0 we need the jbossas >>>> 5 core-libs. Is there any possibility of making a snapshot of these >>>> available in the repository? >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> jboss-development mailing list >>> jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org >>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development >>>

Guys- Could you possibly be a little more helpful? We have new team members who can hardly be expected to know what "jboss embedded" or "integration project" is unless you explain it. In the absence of any wiki pages it's pretty hard to guess. If no-one gives any more pointers then we'll just have to carry on as we're doing now... :) Adrian wrote: > On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 11:09 +0000, Andy Taylor wrote: > >> This is currently how we do it in JBM 1.4. Is there a Wiki page >> explaining the correct way to integrate jbossas dependencies? >> >> > > No. But there are many discussions on this list on good > programming practice. ;-) > > >> Adrian wrote: >> >>> On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 10:40 +0000, Andy Taylor wrote: >>> >>> >>>> currently we're pulling in >>>> http://repository.jboss.com/jbossas/core-libs/4.2.2.GA/ this is because >>>> as you stay we are deployable standalone and need these libraries. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> That's a different issue to what you should be compiling over. >>> >>> You should be compiling over the integration project and letting >>> jboss-4.2.x, 5.0.x or jboss embedded (which is what you should >>> really be using as a standalone runtime) implement them how it >>> likes. >>> >>> >>> >>>> Ales Justin wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Which core libs? >>>>> >>>>> Sounds like you're not using integration project? :-) >>>>> >>>>> Since I guess that's the way to do it, if you want to have it >>>>> standalone or used in different env than JBossAS. >>>>> >>>>> But you probably require a bunch on non existing integration pieces. :-) >>>>> >>>>> Andy Taylor wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> As part of the development of JBoss Messaging 2.0 we need the jbossas >>>>>> 5 core-libs. Is there any possibility of making a snapshot of these >>>>>> available in the repository? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> jboss-development mailing list >>>>> jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org >>>>> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ jboss-development mailing list jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

> Could you possibly be a little more helpful? No. :-) Not that we don't want to be, but integration is something each project needs to know on its own how to do it. And, yes, it far from trivial to do some decent integration. > We have new team members who can hardly be expected to know what > "jboss embedded" or "integration project" is unless you explain it. Yup, embedded, see Bill's wiki. ;-) But, if you do your integration right, embedded will then be a walk in the park. ;-) > In the absence of any wiki pages it's pretty hard to guess. > > If no-one gives any more pointers then we'll just have to carry on as > we're doing now... Sure. But please do it in integration sense. Take your time and see what all needs to plug-in into AS, and make it interface/abstract. The first version probably won't be perfect, but with each integration release that you do, it will get better. And whining about new members doesn't fit in. Integration is the notion that should be obvious. It's just the abstraction that is hard, but that's why you're here and not writing Struts2. ;-) _______________________________________________ jboss-development mailing list jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

Adrian and Ales are not pedestrian, that's way too 20th century...

On 11/15/2007 02:19 PM, Tim Fox wrote: > Purlease.... cut the sermon about the theoretical principles of > integration, no one asked that. > > We just asked where to get more information on your project. > > Adrian grudgingly provided that, that's all we need. Thanks :) > > BTW Next time someone stops you in the street and asks you for > directions to the nearest station, and you use the same kind of > response.. be prepared to get a black eye :) > > > > Ales Justin wrote: >>> Could you possibly be a little more helpful? >> >> No. :-) >> >> Not that we don't want to be, but integration is something each >> project needs to know on its own how to do it. >> And, yes, it far from trivial to do some decent integration. >> >>> We have new team members who can hardly be expected to know what >>> "jboss embedded" or "integration project" is unless you explain it. >> >> Yup, embedded, see Bill's wiki. ;-) >> But, if you do your integration right, embedded will then be a walk >> in the park. ;-) >> >>> In the absence of any wiki pages it's pretty hard to guess. >>> >>> If no-one gives any more pointers then we'll just have to carry on >>> as we're doing now... >> >> Sure. >> But please do it in integration sense. >> Take your time and see what all needs to plug-in into AS, and make >> it interface/abstract. >> The first version probably won't be perfect, but with each >> integration release that you do, it will get better. >> >> And whining about new members doesn't fit in. Integration is the >> notion that should be obvious. It's just the abstraction that is >> hard, but that's why you're here and not writing Struts2. ;-) >> _______________________________________________ >> jboss-development mailing list >> jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org >> https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development > > _______________________________________________ > jboss-development mailing list > jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development _______________________________________________ jboss-development mailing list jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 13:31 +0000, Tim Fox wrote: > Sacha Labourey wrote: >> Adrian and Ales are not pedestrian, that's way too 20th century... > I guess that's the case with most AI's. Shame those models don't come > pre-installed with the "social skills" module ;) Why is it social skills if somebody (to use your example in its proper context) walks into a street and shouts at the top of their voice (i.e. broadcasts to all members of the mailing list wasting #subsribers x ~20 seconds to read e-mail in time) where is X? Don't be surprised if one of those assailed tells you to go buy a map. ;-)

On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 15:01 +0100, Sacha Labourey wrote: > well, you could imagine that if somebody is shouting and selling > newspapers at the exit of the subway and you don't want to buy one, that > you simply ignore him. Yeh, but then you end up with something like the core. Noise to signal ratio -> 0%

Its been a nice introduction to JBoss. Thank you all. Sacha Labourey wrote: > Mr. Taylor, your single post transformed jboss-dev into the.core! we > should sue you. > > On 11/15/2007 03:07 PM, Adrian wrote: >> On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 15:01 +0100, Sacha Labourey wrote: >>> well, you could imagine that if somebody is shouting and selling >>> newspapers at the exit of the subway and you don't want to buy one, >>> that you simply ignore him. >> >> Yeh, but then you end up with something like the core. >> Noise to signal ratio -> 0% > _______________________________________________ > jboss-development mailing list > jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org > https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

you have been Adrian'ized, that's a privilege. The AlesJustinization was a novelty to me.

well, then help them do the integration :) tell them in which module to put the SPI, in which one to put their implementation, write a wiki page explaining all of this and giving links to an existing implementation in SVN, etc.

the MC is a GREAT piece of technology that many ISV will simply LOVE. But in order to get there we will have to write A HUGE AMOUNT of documentation. Real documentation, not the one that require an IQ higher than 150 ;)

Which core libs? Sounds like you're not using integration project? :-) Since I guess that's the way to do it, if you want to have it standalone or used in different env than JBossAS. But you probably require a bunch on non existing integration pieces. :-) Andy Taylor wrote: > As part of the development of JBoss Messaging 2.0 we need the jbossas > 5 core-libs. Is there any possibility of making a snapshot of these > available in the repository? _______________________________________________ jboss-development mailing list jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

> And, I beg you... don't suggest rewriting out test suite to work with > mock versions of the dependencies.... (We had this conversation before). I'm already running current Maven2 config inside AS5_trunk to build me IDEA's project files. And as such, maven already creates and installs AS5 artifacts.

So, if this was already fixed/done - and I know Paul is working as much as he can on this - this would do the job for you. > BTW sorry for calling you and Adrian AI's, you know we love you > really :) Only a couple of beers, not words, will clear this insult. :-) _______________________________________________ jboss-development mailing list jboss-development(a)lists.jboss.org https://lists.jboss.org/mailman/listinfo/jboss-development

JBM requires all those things - clearly our _runtime_ has no dependencies on concrete implementations, but for testing we need concrete implementations so we can run our tests, so we still need them exported from AS via the repository, like is done for AS 4.2.x

And, I beg you... don't suggest rewriting out test suite to work with mock versions of the dependencies.... (We had this conversation before).

Adrian wrote: > On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 14:42 +0000, Tim Fox wrote: >> JBM requires all those things - clearly our _runtime_ has no >> dependencies on concrete implementations, but for testing we need >> concrete implementations so we can run our tests, so we still need >> them exported from AS via the repository, like is done for AS 4.2.x >> > > And I'm saying that is what jboss embedded should give you. > If you're using the integration project then it's just another > implementation of that spi. > JBoss embedded used to run with JBM, until the latest refactoring over summer.

Bill

On Thu, 2007-11-15 at 16:43 +0000, Tim Fox wrote: > Andy is currently in the process of turning JBM into sexy naked POJOs. > This will allow us to run in the MC of course, also > embedded/bootstrapped in any piece of code without any JNDI dependencies > etc. It's nice stuff. And are you using "use case xml" for the configuration? e.g. http://www.jboss.com/index.html?module=bb&op=viewtopic&p=4062687#... we've had that in the aop-mc integration for two years, I saw somebody just "discovered the idea" and called it the high sounding title "Domain Specific Modelling for IOC" http://www.pocomatic.com/docs/whitepapers/dsm/ Except it uses xslt, yuck! We've being doing that with our datasources for 4 years. :-)